Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

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Joined: Jul 10 2013
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ADTPro is sending garbled text when I try to send data to boot my Apple IIe, but it's consistent garbled text. Any suggestions?

I've an Apple IIe I'm trying to talk to, and recently purchased a Super Serial Card. Following the instructions on the site, I can get the "APPLE SSC:" prompt, but when I give the send/recieve commands from each machine, I get garbled text. It's always the same garbled text, however, which leads me to believe it might be a baud setting, although I'm using 9600 baud/"APPLE SSC:14B" commands. Different baud settings will make the characters different, of course, but also consistent. At 9600 baud the read when I try "Speediboot" out starts as follows:

]CP

?SYNTAX ERROR
]j2\
]\
]2\
]\
]2\
]L2A PG$"52L2 !#HMJ

(etc...)

I'm mainly listing this in case someone might be able figure out if there's a bit rate way to translate from "CP" to "CALL -151".

Ways that make the situation more challenging:
-I'm using Windows 7 on a Dell Laptop
-I'm using Slot 1 on the Apple IIe board, the other slots are either taken or crowded out by other cards.
-I'm using this modem cable currently - I've tried both the "Modem" and "Terminal" settings on the card. This above text is with the card on the "Terminal" setting. The "Modem" setting does not seem to send any information.
-I also have an Airlink 101 Serial-USB converter to make the last connection to my laptop. This setup may be the problem, but these were the cables I had around at the time - could there be a Null-Modem/Serial Conflict? The drivers _seem_ to be OK (something I'm a little surprised by, myself).

The thing is, the whole process seems to be pretty close to working. My initial plan is to try another cable, followed by a different, non-Windows 7 machine, but is there some head-slapping element or setting I'm overlooking, given these symptoms? Would the other switches on the Super Serial Card have anything to do with this?

Thanks to all in advance!

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Joined: Apr 11 2006
Posts: 1013
Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

Working backwards...

Revontuli wrote:

The thing is, the whole process seems to be pretty close to working. My initial plan is to try another cable, followed by a different, non-Windows 7 machine, but is there some head-slapping element or setting I'm overlooking, given these symptoms? Would the other switches on the Super Serial Card have anything to do with this?

Trying different combinations should prove enlightening. Make sure you're setting the DIP switches like the documentation tells you to:
http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#Super_Serial_cabling
It smells like either a baud rate setting (and the only thing you should have "set" yourself is the Ctrl-A 14B thing... the server should always be left on its defaults) or the cabling is at fault.

Revontuli wrote:

-I also have an Airlink 101 Serial-USB converter to make the last connection to my laptop. This setup may be the problem, but these were the cables I had around at the time - could there be a Null-Modem/Serial Conflict? The drivers _seem_ to be OK (something I'm a little surprised by, myself).

Either it is something head-slapping (that you're not telling us), or it is the cable. That's how these things work.

Revontuli wrote:

-I'm using this modem cable currently - I've tried both the "Modem" and "Terminal" settings on the card. This above text is with the card on the "Terminal" setting. The "Modem" setting does not seem to send any information.

You do know there's a whole page devoted to how to wire these up, right? Wink
http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#Super_Serial_cabling

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

(can't seem to delete this messgage)

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Joined: May 27 2013
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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

I have a belkin cable with almost the same model number and it works for me fine except I have not tried to "boot" my iie with it. I have done "Bootstrapping" with my iie with a different cable and that worked fine.

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Joined: May 27 2009
Posts: 943
Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

The very first time I used ADTpro years and years ago I had a bitch of a time getting it rolling. Just the thought of transferring files from a PC to Apple II was utterly overwhelming! And I just haphazardly connected everything together forgetting a lot of details. But working through the procedure step by step and clearing up ambiguities and unknowns and I-think-so's fixed the problem.

@INSANITOR
A one-digit difference in cable model numbers can make it or break it. It sure as hell looks exactly like mine. I'd have to check the number before I say yay or nay. I'll check the cable and see if I still have its packaging when I get home tonight.

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Posts: 81
Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

My suggestion is to run a terminal emulator (e.g. TeraTerm, YAT) on the PC. Send one letter at a time, and see how it comes out on the other side (the Apple IIe). Characters like "@" and "A" are useful since their binary ASCII code is 01000000 and 01000001 respectively. Look up the ASCII code for the received character and see how what kind of transformation the bit pattern underwent.

I got a feeling you might have a stop bit problem (as opposed to baud rate problem). That would allow one character at a time, but a burst of characters would end up garbled.

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

When I used to give away ADTpro kits I included the very same Belkin cable. And I still have one of my own I use today. So you can put a Green=Good sticker on it, unless you used it as rope for a pull-toy for the kids. All bets would then be off and you need to get another one.

So your cable seems to be the right one if it is labeled F2L088-6. Next check that the modem/terminal block has the arrow pointing down toward the 50-pin slot connector.

SSC in Slot 2 (put it here, now, for testing purposes)

Check your dip switches according to ADTpro website.

That's pretty much it for the Apple/ADTpro/SSC/cable stuff.

Your next troubleshooting area is going to be drivers for the USB-to-SERIAL converter cable. Since I don't have that exact model I can't tell you anything specific. But look in device manager (or equivalent in whatever OS you got rolling) and you'll want to set that port/adapter (thru windows) to be:

Com: 1
Baud: 9600 (or 115200)
DataBits: 8
Parity: None
Stop bits:1
FlowControl: None
Use FIFO (requires 16550 UART): yes
RX and TX buffers to max, turn them down if you got problems.

Well, that's pretty much windows default settings and that's what's on my system which is working. You may have more or different settings which you'll have to work through on your own.

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

First, thanks to everyone for replying quickly! I'm finally able to give things another try today...

...and I'm stuck in much the same place, but much more confidently Smile

I connected to my Apple with Tera Term, and can happily send keyboard characters over from my laptop, so the cabling/connection _seems_ to be working fine as far as that is concerned. Going to ADTPro and doing the "Speediboot" ritual still sends (roughly) the same garbled text, however. I've tried two sets of Serial cables and 2 sets of USB-Serial converters, with no further luck, but as the Tera Term test seems to work, I don't think it's the cables, or the hardware settings they have, really. If such a connection is good enough for basic text in Tera Term, it should be good enough for transferring commands and data ADTPro, correct? Or am I being naive?

This is leading me to believe there's a command line setting in ADTPro I've overlooked. I'm using v1.2.8 - I'm running from the .bat file, and trying to leave its default settings more or less alone at this point. The dip switches are place in the recommended position on the Super Serial Card (although how much would that make a difference if I can send accurate text from a different connection like Tera Term?).

I'm also wondering if the disk images/commands being sent are correct, in the proper format, or possibly corrupted, or if I need to download another set of disk images that aren't with the .zip file. Would there be a way to test the images through Tera Term (could I try a file transfer through there, for instance?)

Thanks again for the replies everyone! They have helped, even though I'm still stuck at the same step. I am little better informed, and a bit more confident of my previous steps, which is very important in a project like this.

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

Revontuli wrote:

If such a connection is good enough for basic text in Tera Term, it should be good enough for transferring commands and data ADTPro, correct? Or am I being naive?

Well, that's a little naive, but not for the reasons you might think.

Let's go back to fundamentals, as Keatah suggests:

1) Are you turning on the Apple II with NO disk in the drive? I.e. no operating system is active?

2) Can you try ticking the "Apple IIc W/Imagewriter Cable" box in the serial comms dialog and see if that changes anything?

3) If the answer to 1) is yes, and 2) doesn't help, can you shoot a video of yourself attempting this? I've diagnosed myriad problems like this by observing something the questioner just happens to fail to mention...

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

It works! I just has to use different modern machine...

I tried connecting to the Apple II with my Mac mini, and it loaded without issue. Apparently the problem is somewhere in the workings of Windows 7 and/or the PC computer I was using.

Thanks to everyone again for their help! I was finally able to backup old files and projects, including some of my first, onto modern formats. I am very thankful a program like this exists!

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

For windows 7 machines, the program requires java. I believe both 32 bit and 64 bit versions must be installed on a 64 bit pc for it to work, but I could be mistaken.

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Re: Trouble with ADTPro sending garbled text to Apple IIe

insanitor wrote:

For windows 7 machines, the program requires java. I believe both 32 bit and 64 bit versions must be installed on a 64 bit pc for it to work, but I could be mistaken.

No, just one - but it has to match the bit-ness of your operating system. Java installers won't check for that, unfortunately.