Color Classic Mystic upgrade questions

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Joined: Feb 11 2006
Posts: 63

Hello Everyone.

I am new to the Macintosh and haven't actually recieved my Classic Color system yet. I wanted to ask some questions and hopefully get answers on upgrading the unit even more. I'm hoping some of you here might be able to answer some or all of these questions. Smile

1. What is the largest sized SCSI Hard Drive that the Mystic will support? I have a 250mb drive in the unit that is on its way to me, but I'd love to be able to get a drive in the GB size range. (Ex: 4, 20, 40GB, etc...)

2. I've read about the video upgrade to 640x480. I have the following questions. If I get the upgrade will...
A) The video resolution be swappable? I mean can I revert back to the original resolution via the OS like we can in
Windows, or am I stuck with 640x480 then?
B) In 640x480 does the screen image still fill out the viewable area on the monitor or because of the resoution size is the
viewable image smaller than the full size of the monitor?

3. What is the max RAM I can install into the CC Mystic and where can I buy more ram? The system I bought comes with 16mb, but perhaps that is too small. I saw a post about 128mb RAM for the system. Is it possible to get 256mb and if so where can I buy the proper RAM?

4. What OS is the best to use? OS 7.5 comes installed, but is that the best OS for a Mystic upgrade system with 16mb RAM?

5. How much video ram is suggested in these systems? I think it comes with 512kb VRAM. Is that too little? Should I look to get more VRAM?

6. What about processor? I read that the chip on the LC 575 is changeable to a faster processor with FPU. What is the best processor to get for this board and other than eBay, is there any place to look for them?

7. What type of joysticks are available for these systems? I'm sure I'll be interested in trying out some games, so is there a specific type of joystick that I'll need?

8. I'm hopefully getting the Apple II emulator board for this system from a fellow member of these forums. I wanted to know if there are add-on emulator boards for a IIGS? That is unless the IIGS software can run on the CC without emulation. I don't know if that is possible, so I thought I'd ask. Smile

9. Can an external monitor be hooked up to this unit? I'm sure it can, but the question would be this. Back in the days of the CC, is a specific type of monitor needed or will standard SVGA monitors work? If standard, how about flat panel monitors with a typical VGA input port?

10. When searching for software for this system, what do I need to look for? (System Specs) Anything that runs on OS 6.x-7.x, or is there more information I need to know before downloading or buying software for the system?

Well, theres 10 questions. Sorry for such a long post. I just would like to get these questions out there as the answers will help me get a good understanding of the system and what upgrades I should look to get. I appreciate any help/advice that any of you might be able to give.

Sincerely,
John

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Joined: Dec 21 2004
Posts: 82
Re: Color Classic Upgrades

Hello and welcome. You've come to the right place. Hopefully, I'll get most of these answered...correctly...
1. You can put a large hard drive in, but I would partition the 'Start Up' drive to be less than 2GB. I've had some success with using Ultra 3 SCSIs (used one in a Centris 650), but I formatted the first partition (the Start Up drive) using the Mac OS Standard, then used the rest of the drive as an application/data storage disk using HFS+.
2. There won't be anything to buy, except a soldering iron and some wire. There isn't a card upgrade. That being said:
A. No, the video resolution cannot go back to the original, although mine does go to 800x600.
B. No, it doesn't quite fill out the entire screen. There is an FAQ concerning the why's.
3. I don't think it is possible to get 256MB into a Mystic. I've got 128MB and I've tried installing RAMDoubler, but it froze the Mystic.
4. I like 8.1. YMMV.
5. Get 1MB VRAM. It never hurts.
6. Yes, pull the 68LC040 and replace with a full 68040. This website has a trading post. Ask around.
7. I'm not sure what kind of game that requires a joystick would look that good on a 10" screen. That said, I have played F18 Hornet on my Mystic and used a Gravis Firebird with some success.
8. There is a IIGS emulator, based on the XGS emulator, called iGS. It does require a IIGS ROM. Sorry, I'm unaware of any hardware IIGS emulation.
9. There are LC video cards which can help you there. The Focus brands of cards have 'S-Video' out, so you could hook it up to your 40" plasma .
10. No, nothing special other than the OS.

Don't forget to look at FAQs on this site, ColourClassicFAQ.com, LowEndMac.com, and our wonderful moderator's own site, http://www.stuartbell.dsl.pipex.com/PowerCC/

Jack

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Joined: Feb 11 2006
Posts: 63
OS Install?

Jack,
I just read in a FAQ about installing OS 8.1. It says you have to do some hacing to make it work on a CC. If you have a Mystic upgrade, do you still have to tinker with installing the system or is that only on the default CC board? Also, I have an external CD-Rom. Will that work to install 8.1 from CD?

You mention the Focus video card with S-Video out. Do I need to look for a specific model? Or just any that work with the LC line of Macs? I saw one that mentioned it had a built in Ethernet port on the card as well, but I'm not sure if that model will work with the LC 575.

Thanks
John

PS: So my CC Mystic can use 18 or 20gb SCSI drives? Just format partition 1 to 1.5gb and the rest as a single or multiple partition and install software to those secondary partitions?

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Joined: Dec 21 2004
Posts: 82
Re: OS Install?

The hacking comes in when you go from 7.1 or 7.5 to 8.x. I just put in a 18GB Ultra 3 SCSI (10K RPM) the other night. I used a spare Mac to format the drive with Lido, did a default install, then popped it into the Mystic. She booted up right away. If you don't have an extra Mac, the process should work using the Mystic. The external CD will work great.

No specific model. The card I have is the TV Pro LC, since I couldn't find the TV Pro LC/E and I already have a Comm Slot Ethernet card. Yes, it fits in the Mystic just fine. Drivers come with the card.

Yes, just format a 1 or 2 GB partition as a Mac Standard and set up the rest of the disk as a single HFS+ partition (2TB addressable).
Others on this list might have other preferences on partitioning, but this is what is working for me. You might be able to use Apples HD Setup as long as it is the patched one, but I'd recommend using Lido or FWB's drive formatter.

Jack

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Joined: Feb 11 2006
Posts: 63
These Focus products

Jack,
I found these items for sale on the internet. Do you know if either of these will work with a CC Mystic?

Focus L-TV Card for Macintosh

display your computer on any TV
software controlled flicker features
good for macintosh systems
new in box.
model 444-1260

or this

Focus LTV Portable Pro LTV mac apple video presentation

This one is an external box that hooks up to a 15 pin video connection on a Mac. Does the CC Mystic have a 15 pin video port? My CC was shipped to me the other day, so I don't have it in front of me to check. Smile

Thanks Again
John

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Joined: Dec 16 2005
Posts: 244
I have a 575 motherboard, wit

I have a 575 motherboard, with processor, and a believed-to-be-working PRAM battery. If you havent found one already.

John

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iMac G5 17" - 160GB HD - 1GB RAM

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Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 180
Not much more to add to Jack's comprehensive reply. . . .

1. 2Gb should be enough for most purposes - it's an OS limit, not a h/w one.
3. I find a 64Mb SIMM more than enough!
4. I'm with Jack on 8.1 - but you need the RAM for it.
5. Agreed
6. 'Olde Mac Milt' used to be a good source on eBay for 68040s - not sure if he's still around, I clocked a 575 to 43MHz, but it MAY affect IIe card operation.
9. Some external video cards work great - giving screen spanning, but again they're PDS, so you can't use a IIe card simultaneously.

I have several CC/575s so I can have a mix of upgrades!

Stuart

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Developer of the PowerCC site a long time ago.

dvsjr's picture
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Joined: Jun 8 2004
Posts: 135
Check out the Presto Plus from Sonnett

Adds

32 MB Ram
Processor upgrade to Quadra Speeds
onboard ethernet
Mac OS 8 compatibility

They release them on ebay periodically, I bought one there and LOVE it. So simple to install, makes the Classic hum.

best

dvsjr

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Joined: Feb 11 2006
Posts: 63
Sonnet

I saw their upgrade already and was interested in it, but I thought it was only needed if you had a regular CC board. I thought the LC 575 Mystic upgrade didn't require the Sonnet board. Is that Sonnet add-on board still useful even if you have the faster LC 575 board and processor? If so I'll definitely buy it. Smile

John

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Posts: 63
RAM and VRAM questions

What type of RAM and VRAM chips do I need to look for? Are they specific to the Mac, or will regular common RAM like 70ns Pentium type ram work? I'd like to get 128mb or whatever the max is that the LC575 can hold.

Thanks
John

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Posts: 135
well

I guess this applies if you havent already gone to the trouble of finding an LC MOBO to switch with your CC. The Presto has several advantages, and is faster. If you buy the Presto, you are attaching the PDS card to the CC mobo. For comparison, the LC 575 has a 33 MHz 68LC040, the presto comes with a 68040 66/33. If you use the Presto, you get 32 MB of ram *in addition to* the ram already on the motherboard. The other benefit is the Presto comes with an RJ45 for onboard ethernet support. Plug and play. I posted to the applefritter forums from my classic using netscape 2.0 a while back. Schweet stuff.

here is my post made using my CC: http://www.applefritter.com/node/10391

Pic: http://tinyurl.com/993r7

d

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Posts: 82
Re: These Focus products

I have the Focus L*TV Pro LC. Key phrase is the "LC". Beware as there is a NuBus version of the L*TV. The non-Pro's only had RCA-type video out, where as the "Pro" version had S-Video as well. I'll have to get you the specific model when I get home.
No, the CC doesn't have a 15-pin video connection. You'd have to put a video card in the CC to connect the Portable box to it.
For specific LC video cards, try http://www.lowendmac.com/video/lc/index.html

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Olde Mac Milt

He's taking a vacation right now moving stuff to a new space. He should be up soon, though. I need to get hold of him for a 'fix'.

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Olde Mac Milt

I'm looking forward to seeing what items his has for sale. Smile

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Posts: 82
Re: Sonnet

No, you don't need the Sonnet Presto if you already have a 575 board. Just pull the processor and replace with a full '040 33MHz. Not sure how useful a full '040 33MHz processor would be if one was still on a 16-bit data path.

The 575 has a Comm Slot I, so just buy a network adapter to fit that, then you can run your IIe emulator (or a video card, but not both) and have networking with it.

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Re: RAM and VRAM questions

You really need to check out the FAQs. They have all the information including the SIMM chips to look for. VRAM is plentiful on eBay or LEM swap.

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Re: Olde Mac Milt

He always has something good.

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Posts: 180
Re: Sonnet

JGallemore wrote:

No, you don't need the Sonnet Presto if you already have a 575 board. Just pull the processor and replace with a full '040 33MHz. Not sure how useful a full '040 33MHz processor would be if one was still on a 16-bit data path.

The 575 has a Comm Slot I, so just buy a network adapter to fit that, then you can run your IIe emulator (or a video card, but not both) and have networking with it.

Jack, have you got a CS1 ethernet card working with a IIe card installed? Stuart

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Posts: 63
VRAM?

I read through the FAQs and ordered the 128mb RAM chip. I looked but didn't see where I can find the 1mb VRAM chip. Can anyone tell me where or what to look for? Finally, I'm interested in the comm port ethernet card. Can anyone recommend which ones are best and where I might be able to find them?

Thanks
John

PS: Is MAC OS 8.1 still sold anywhere or do I have to resort to eBay? Smile

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Re: Sonnet

No, I haven't. I haven't gotten a IIe card, but I did have my Focus card with my CSI NIC working. Is there an issue with the two?

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Re; VRAM?

It will be 2 512k VRAM chips. I'm using Apple P/N 630-0044 (4*8 Display VRAM SIMM). You might be able to scrounge them off of some LCs.

The CSI card comes up for sale in some of the regular sales area. Just keep your eye out. John, you might even try your local thrift stores. People always unload computers there.

8.1 is still sold. If you are adverse to eBay, I highly recommend LEM Swap or this site's "For Sale" forum.
Jack

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Comm II Ethernet card

Will a Comm II ethernet card work in a LC575? I saw one for sale and wanted to get more information before I bought it.

Thanks
John

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No.

Comm Slot II's have different tabs. Your only Ethernet networking options are CSI's, LC PDS, or SCSI/Ethernet.

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The LC 575 mobo I have has on

The LC 575 mobo I have has one of those little nifty CS1 ethernet cards. Works quite well.

John

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Apple say

there can be problems with a CS Ethernet card and a IIe card. I found that with a IIe card installed, the Ethernet card wouldn't work, even when the IIe card wasn't active.

Stuart

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Re: Apple say

StuartBell wrote:

there can be problems with a CS Ethernet card and a IIe card. I found that with a IIe card installed, the Ethernet card wouldn't work, even when the IIe card wasn't active.

Stuart

That's rather bizarre. I can understand the emulator not having access to networking, but to shut it down completely is rather strange. Does the CS have power at all? Could it be a power supply issue? What about slot addressing ala SE/30?

Simply put, that just crazy.
Jack

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Re: Apple say

JGallemore wrote:
StuartBell wrote:

there can be problems with a CS Ethernet card and a IIe card. I found that with a IIe card installed, the Ethernet card wouldn't work, even when the IIe card wasn't active.

Stuart

That's rather bizarre. I can understand the emulator not having access to networking, but to shut it down completely is rather strange. Does the CS have power at all? Could it be a power supply issue? What about slot addressing ala SE/30?

Simply put, that just crazy.
Jack

Man, I hate replying to my own post, but according to the LC/Apple IIe FAQ I found on Mandrake, the CSI ethernet cards "may not" be compatible, but external connectors are. Assuming that CS1 modems work, then it might be a chip set issue or incompatibilites with the shared networking software. My 2 cents.

Jack