OS X Version Question

21 replies [Last post]
nashman50's picture
Offline
Joined: May 22 2005
Posts: 55

Should I buy Mac OS 10.1.? or 10.2.8 for my Beige G3 233 with 320 RAM? Could I also get the iPod Nano to work on these versions, or will I have to keep using my Windows machine? Thanks a million!

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
nashman50's picture
Offline
Joined: May 22 2005
Posts: 55
Wrong RAM Amount

Now that I think of it, I think that the RAM is 384 MB. I cannot check now because my mom and dad will get mad because it is my bed time. A bed time at 15, crazy!

Offline
Joined: Dec 19 2003
Posts: 832
v.10.2 is way more stable

OS 10.1 was a beautiful idea, poorly executed. OS 10.2.8 is quite functional. 10.3.? is great and handles most modern programs just fine. For any of these 384 MB should be fine.

When you get older (are you tired of reading/hearing that phrase yet?) you may realize that your resources are limited, especially your time and energy levels. You will probably decide that there are special things that you REALLY want to do; "priorities." In order to achieve your goals, your priorities, you will need to focus your energy and time. That means getting plenty of sleep, and sometimes getting up very early, or at least exactly "on time." This is one of several subtle habits that lead to a successful life.

Mutant_Pie

cwsmith's picture
Offline
Joined: Oct 13 2005
Posts: 699
Errrmmm, ...

iPod nano requires a USB 2.0 connection. A Beige is probably not going to play nice with a USB 2.0 card. And you'll need at least Panther (10.3) to handle USB 2.0, which in my experience doesn't play nice at all on a Beige. Even with the max 384 MB RAM.

__________________

Dozens of Macs; a handful of PCs; Apple ][e, ][c and ][gs; a few iPods; lots of parts
17 guitars, 2 baritone guitars, alto guitar, 6 bass guitars, bajo sexto, 3 ukuleles, mandolin, banjo, sitar
3/4 scale upright bass, 4pc drum kit, congas, travel congas, bongos, cajon, cabasa, 12 harmonicas
http://www.cwsmith.fmhttp://www.facebook.com/cwsmith2620

Offline
Joined: Dec 19 2003
Posts: 832
USB compatibility

Isn't USB2 backwardly compatible with a USB1 port? I think that he can have a USB1 port.

Mutant_Pie

Offline
Joined: Sep 23 2005
Posts: 316
nano....

will work with usb 1.1.... INCREDIBLY slow... and, the iPod might get kind of hot. Just think about the differences here.... USB 1.1= 12Mb/s, USB 2=480Mb/s

KIND of a difference Laughing out loud

cwsmith's picture
Offline
Joined: Oct 13 2005
Posts: 699
Also, IIRC, USB 2.0 operates

Also, IIRC, USB 2.0 operates at a higher voltage too -- so the ipod doesn't need to occupy two ports like the external HD cases of olde.

__________________

Dozens of Macs; a handful of PCs; Apple ][e, ][c and ][gs; a few iPods; lots of parts
17 guitars, 2 baritone guitars, alto guitar, 6 bass guitars, bajo sexto, 3 ukuleles, mandolin, banjo, sitar
3/4 scale upright bass, 4pc drum kit, congas, travel congas, bongos, cajon, cabasa, 12 harmonicas
http://www.cwsmith.fmhttp://www.facebook.com/cwsmith2620

coius's picture
Offline
Joined: Aug 25 2004
Posts: 1975
stay with 10.1

10.2 is nice, but only on a really fast computer. I would say the best of all the OS X OS's would be panther. It is the less resource sucking OS X there is. They also cleaned up the code that was sloppy and made OS X 10.2 sloowww...
10.3 works better than 10.1 in the fact that it is more responsive. But you will want to get a video card (which are cheap) as the Built-in on the G3 can be a PITA to work with under X, since it will turn off randomly on you. That was one of the major reasons Apple dropped support for the beige, is because OS X does not play happily with the built-in video on ANY of the beige G3 systems

A nice original Radeon or Radeon 7000 works nicely with the G3 series machines, and can keep up very well. They also tend to be cheap enough for it to be worth it. The other thing you might want to look at if you are willing to try it, is to overclock the G3.
I got mine to 280MHz from the 233 it was at. I also pushed the Bus to 83.3Mhz which also led to a major increase which was noticable.
This site can help you but you must be willing to make the time to do it, as it will take trial and error when you are overclocking the CPU. You will want to do a couple of stress tests when you do it, and try to get a better heatsink on the CPU, as it WILL increase the temp of the processor.
If you need any help with installing OS X or overclocking the G3, either PM me (slower) or email me at (faster) and I can help you do both of them.

I also would like to know what revision of the G3 you have. you can find this by looking at the ROM and the board, as they will both have markings on it.

Chow!

__________________

See my PB540c 33Mhz serve a website! http://yui-ikari.coius.info/

madmax_2069's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 24 2005
Posts: 664
i have tiger 10.4.8 running l

i have tiger 10.4.8 running like a scalded dog on my Beige G3. my specs are in my sig

im also running with the stock onboard video with the 4mb sodimm vram upgrade ( to make it 6mb vram onboard and a ATI Radeon 7000 ME PCI for the external monitor.

i ran into a few problems in tiger one i got a fix for ( the same thing used to fix the video blackout lockup problem that hit these systems in the 10.2.8 update) i installed 10.4 from a cd then i did the terminal commands (once booted into the OS) said in this fix

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=25564

and then you reboot . the onboard video didnt come back on, so it was a good thing i had the Radeon 7000 ME installed then i ran the combo update to 10.4.7 and rebooted. the onboard video came back on this reboot and everything has been great since no onboard video blackout anywhere in site. that fix works in jag 10.2.8 panther and tiger but in panther and tiger to do this you better have a second videocard to use cause the onboard video wont work till you update to the latest version of panther or tiger.

now in jag this fix dont disable the video like it did in tiger or panther (but will fix the video blackout lockup also) so its safe to do this without a second video card for jag. i also did this fix when i had the video problem in 10.2.8 and worked out fine (never to see a blackout lockup again). even if you have this problem in 10.2 this fix might also work for it

so far tiger is running great on my Beige G3 AIO (after the fix was applied never to see another video blackout again no matter how hard i ran the system).

the best thing you can do to the Beige G3 is to buy a ATI Radeon Mac Edition PCI , or a ATI Radeon 7000 Mac Edition PCI (the better card is the ATI Radeon ME PCI) and do away from using the onboard video (that is if its not a AIO). and to buy 2 80 wire 40 pin IDE cables and a G3 CPU upgrade. i bought my G3 450mhz cpu off ebay , it was a used pull out of a B&W. with those you will see a nice performance gain

if you want 768mb ram you need certain types of memory. i bought mine from here
http://www.datamem.com/memory_select_frame.asp_Q_C_E_1321-G3_BW450

yea its for a B&W but it works great in my Beige G3 system and it sees all 256mb of the stick

__________________

Beige G3 AIO,Yikes, Digital Audio, Performa 475, Newton MP 2100, Apple IIgs, HP D530 SFF, Wyse winterm 3360SE
http://www.Apple2online.com

gobabushka's picture
Offline
Joined: Apr 26 2004
Posts: 494
the ipod nano will work just

the ipod nano will work just fine with usb 1.1, just SLOWLY!!!!! i use my ipod video on my pismo all the time. My suggestion to you would be to either go for mac os x 10.2 or 10.3. preferibly 10.3 and if ur gonna use an ipod, u need at least 10.2.8

__________________

"I reject your reality and substute my own!!!" -Adam Savage, MythBusters

nashman50's picture
Offline
Joined: May 22 2005
Posts: 55
I want to change jumpers

I want to change those jumper settings but I am not sure exactly what to do, and I do not want to screw anything up. I would like to get at lease 266 MHz out of it, and more if possible. An exact how-to guide would be great! Also, do I need to keep that metal thing that fits around the CD-ROM drive, because mine is bent and it is a pain in the but to get it back so that the CD eject button will work?

kmoniz5414's picture
Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 15
Re: I want to change jumpers

nashman50 wrote:

I want to change those jumper settings but I am not sure exactly what to do, and I do not want to screw anything up. I would like to get at lease 266 MHz out of it, and more if possible. An exact how-to guide would be great!

http://www.wmld.com/tech/jumperchart2.html

Laughing out loud

Hawaii Cruiser's picture
Offline
Joined: Jan 20 2005
Posts: 1434
I just quickly skimmed this t

I just quickly skimmed this thread, so sorry if I missed something, but I ask the question, why bother overclocking a beige G3 these days? 300, 333, 350, 400mhz G3 ZIFs are about a dime a dozen. I'm sure there's many someones here who've got an extra that they can toss your way. Simply ask for one in a WTB post.

Oh, and about bedtime...well, there's many opinions on that subject and it's relationship to success. I think it was Edison who purposely disrupted his sleep in order to achieve successes. As the story goes, he got his ideas in that state between awake and sleep, so he would deprive himself of sleep and then lie on a couch in his lab gripping a rock in his hand and ponder a problem or need until he was just at that state of drifting off, and if he fell asleep completely, his grip on the rock would release and the thud would wake him up again, and he'd continue this until some insomnolent brainstorm gave him the solution he was after. That's the story, don't know if it's true.

9 to 5 works for some, and not for others. I've done some of my best work at 4am. Passion often leads to the all-nighter. You've got college ahead of you. It would be interesting to see the sleep patterns of the average college student, including the successful ones. Sleep was an iffy proposition for most of the people I knew in college. It's midnight as I type this, and I see that some of the regulars are logged in here with me, and unless they're in the middle of the Pacific too, then they're all way past their bedtimes as well.

On the subject: http://www.applefritter.com/node/10449

But yes, obey your parents. No disrespecting. A good night's sleep is top on the list for Dr. Koop.

nashman50's picture
Offline
Joined: May 22 2005
Posts: 55
Could I Use This?

http://stn2.headgap.com/resale/FMPro?-token=13136207&-db=ProductsC.fp3&-lay=WEB&-format=items.htm&-sortfield=SortID&-Max=40&category=parts&-find

Could I just replace the 233 with the 266 at the bottom of the page? If it will work, how could I go about installing it? Many thanks to everyone who posted!

eeun's picture
Offline
Joined: Dec 19 2003
Posts: 1891
For less than the cost of tha

For less than the cost of that 266, you could get a 300 or maybe even a 333 off ebay (providing ebay is an option available to you). Some of your fellow 'fritters may have one kicking around for a trade, too.

To replace the CPU, remove the heatsink by pressing down on the clip and carefully prying the clip off the socket. The heatsink should just lift off. No need to remove the heatsink grounding wire. Just move the heatsink out of the way.

Pull up the zif release bar and the CPU lifts out easily (ZIF = zero insertion force).

Drop in the new CPU - it'll only fit in one way - and just follow the steps above in reverse to finish up.

Follow the links in posts above to set the jumper speed to match the new CPU.

You could use a small amount of thermal paste on the CPU, but under normal operating conditions, it's not really necessary for a beige G3.

Make sure you are grounded before and during work. I always touch grounded metal, or hold one hand on the computer's metal frame while working. Grounding straps are handy, but I tend to get up and try to walk away while I'm still tethered. Wink

__________________

"Give a man a fire, he's warm for a day. Set a man on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life."
(Terry Pratchett)

madmax_2069's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 24 2005
Posts: 664
i bought a G3 450mhz 1mb l2 c

i bought a G3 450mhz 1mb l2 cache cpu out of a B&W G3 for $37 off ebay . and the cpu is running happily at 466 cause of the 66mhz system bus in my system. the default max cpu speed if you dont overclock the system bus is 466mhz. so a G3 450mhz cpu would be a cheap and great improvement over the stock 233mhz cpu.

Ram would be another thing to look for cause they wil handle 768mb ram when the proper memory is used. i bough my 256mb stick from here.

[url=http://www.datamem.com/memory_select_frame.asp_Q_C_E_1321-G3_BW450]memory upgrade{/url]

the rest of my system's spec's are in my sig below . oh BTW im also running OS X 10.4.8 nicely

i also have bought the 4mb vram sodimm upgrade for the onboard video to make the onboard video 6mb vram and would also give you a proformance gain. if you dont plan on buying a ATI Radeon Mac Edition PCI, or a ATI Radeon 7000 Mac Edition PCI video cards (BTW the Radeon 7000 PCI is a slower card). i use both the onboard video along with the Radeon 7000 . for extended desktop with 2 monitors the built in one is hooked to the onboard and the Radeon 7000 is hooked to a external monitor

__________________

Beige G3 AIO,Yikes, Digital Audio, Performa 475, Newton MP 2100, Apple IIgs, HP D530 SFF, Wyse winterm 3360SE
http://www.Apple2online.com

moosemanmoo's picture
Offline
Joined: Aug 17 2004
Posts: 686
If you are going to spend mor

If you are going to spend more than $30 or so on upgrades for your Beige G3, you should buy a Blue & White G3 tower to replace your G3. The processors are faster from the start, the bus speed is 50% faster, the video card is much better, there is Firewire support, and much more. You can easily get a B&W G3 for less than $50, even from ebay. I can vouch for 10.3's speed on the G3.

If I am not mistaken, a DVD drive also came standard.

__________________

Join the chat on irc.freenode.com, channel #applefritter.

Jon's picture
Jon
Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 2804
DVD as standard was for later

DVD as standard was for later Yikes! and Sawtooths. The DVD drive was an option for B&W.

__________________

I am not in this world to live up to other people's expectations, nor do I feel that the world must live up to mine. - Fritz Perls

madmax_2069's picture
Offline
Joined: Sep 24 2005
Posts: 664
yea and no. my Beige G3 AIO s

Yes and no, Yes cause its a great system and No cause it does have its limits. My Beige G3 AIO seems to be doing fine with what it has. The upgrades i bought for it was well worth it. Its running tiger 10.4.8 like a champ it has never KP on me yet. Im planning on adding a USB2.0/FIREWIRE combo pci card to it some time and maxing out the ram to 768mb. That is only 256mb less than the max amount of ram the B&W and Yikes G4 can hold (1gb)

I have ran xbench 1.3 on this and it is not to bad for what this system is. I scored a 12.71. which is not bad for this system running tiger 10.4.8 with 448mb ram. With more ram i will more than likely see a performance gain.

I seen a B&W with a G4 500mhz cpu in it with a Radeon 7000 with 64mb PCI (PC flashed) and 512mb ram get a score of 16.64 (he was running OS X 10.3.9 and using xbench 1.3). Which is not that much faster than i scored (he scored higher cause of the G4 cpu for the most part and some cause of the 100mhz system bus) . Yea some of the video test's was faster (cause the B&W and Yikes G4 have a 66mhz PCI slot for the video card compared to the 33mhz PCI bus on the Beige G3) but a few was around the same. The hdd test is what killed me cause i am using the onboard IDE controller (which is only capable of 16mb/s) . I do have a Yikes G4 system im trying to build tho. I have the mobo and cpu but i need the case and PSU and frontboard.

If you go over a certain speed in a G4 CPU on a B&W or Yikes G4 (i think its over a G4 of 600mhz and the system bus it turned down) your 100mhz system bus will be knocked down to 66mhz. Only if you plan to keep a G3 CPU in it will you keep the 100mhz system bus. They do make a G3 1.1ghz cpu upgrade for the B&W (which will allow you to keep the 100mhz system bus). There is also a G4 1ghz cpu upgrade for it (but your CPU will be clocked back to 66mhz.

If you are planning on upgrading a B&W to a G4 or upgrading a Yikes G4 system past a certain speed (i think the speed the the system bus gets turned down to 66mhz is a G4 600mhz and up). It would be best to get a sawtooth or newer G4 cause they have a AGP slot for the video card and not to mention it will keep its 100mhz (i think the sawtooth is)-133mhz (anything beyond a sawtooth) system bus speed.

Anything you buy to upgrade a Beige G3 system will also work in a B&W or a Yikes G4 system. So really you can upgrade your Beige G3 to the fullest and still buy a B&W G3 or Yikes G4 later down the road and move all your upgrades you bought for your Beige into the B&W or Yikes system, cause sooner or later if you bought a B&W or Yikes you would have spend the same to upgrade them (plus not mentioning the $50 or more you will spend for buying a B&W or Yikes G4).

__________________

Beige G3 AIO,Yikes, Digital Audio, Performa 475, Newton MP 2100, Apple IIgs, HP D530 SFF, Wyse winterm 3360SE
http://www.Apple2online.com

Oelmuvun's picture
Offline
Joined: Nov 27 2005
Posts: 62
Re: yea and no. my Beige G3 AIO s

madmax_2069 wrote:

I do have a Yikes G4 system im trying to build tho. I have the mobo and cpu but i need the case and PSU and frontboard.

When are you gonna finish that? You can use an ATX PSU and wire the power, reset and NMI switches right up to the Front Panel Board connector on the mobo you know.

madmax_2069 wrote:

If you are planning on upgrading a B&W to a G4 or upgrading a Yikes G4 system past a certain speed (i think the speed the the system bus gets turned down to 66mhz is a G4 600mhz and up). It would be best to get a sawtooth or newer G4 cause they have a AGP slot for the video card and not to mention it will keep its 100mhz (i think the sawtooth is)-133mhz (anything beyond a sawtooth) system bus speed.

Actually, the PM G4 AGP Graphics (Sawtooth, P5, Project E), PM G4 Gigabit Ethernet (Mystic, Medusa2, SnakeBite) and the PM G4 Cube (Trinity, Rubicon) all have 100Mhz System Buses while the PM G4 Digital Audio (Tangent, Clockwork) to low end PM G4 Mirrored Drive Doors (P57) have 133Mhz System Buses.

__________________

OS 9: Beige G3(AT case), 433MHz(350B&W CPU), 768MB RAM, 64MB Radeon 7000, 10/100 NIC, USB1, 80GB 7200RPM HDD
OS X: Digital Audio(ATX case), 1GHz 7455, 1.5GB RAM, 256MB GeForce 6200, SATA, USB2, 500GB HDD

coius's picture
Offline
Joined: Aug 25 2004
Posts: 1975
Re: Wrong RAM Amount

nashman50 wrote:

A bed time at 15, crazy!

I just want to chime in on this a bit. I am in college and I would *Kill* for a set bed time. But when you get done with homework about 2am, have to do other stuff around the house, and may not get done with it all until 4am, then end up waking up for classes and doing it all over starting at 7. It can get quite hectic. I pretty much end up being out at the college all day for classes (full time student. Put my business on the backburner for now) being as tired as all get out.

I really wish I could get a set bedtime like yours. But instead, i end up having to stay up late, not only to get things done, but to succeed. Trust me, be happy when you have all the sleep you need. There are a few of us that would love to have as much sleep as your parents are making you have. There are so many times I want to crawl into bed about an hour after I get up, because I am dead tired, and sometimes have had only 3-4 hours of sleep, everyday for the past 5 days.

Can anyone else in college chime in on this and how much sleep they get?

__________________

See my PB540c 33Mhz serve a website! http://yui-ikari.coius.info/

Jon's picture
Jon
Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 2804
That's on reason I have an A.

That's on reason I have an A.A. degree and didn't finish my B.S. IT. Tkae your college life, add a wife and a new child, working to make mortgage payments, and then a general disinterest/dislike in how the program is being run and taught...

__________________

I am not in this world to live up to other people's expectations, nor do I feel that the world must live up to mine. - Fritz Perls