Dead B&W??? Help anyone?

23 replies [Last post]
Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8

I bought a 400Mhz. B&W G3 and everything was working fine... video, memory, harddrive all functioning perfectly. Then I installed a sonnet G4 processor and all hell broke loose.
When I started the machine with the new processor I got 5 chimes (which I know it means the processor is not correct) so I turned the machine off and put the original processor back in.
Now the machine fires up and I hear the BONG but then nothing...
no video and no harddrive activity.
I've tried unplugging the power, removing the battery and pressing the CUDA button. someone suggested to leave the battery out overnight, which I did.
But what I got (everytime) was three chimes (bad memory) and then nothing.
I have taken the video, memory and the harddrive out and tested each component in my Beige G3 and everything works there but not in the B&W.
pressing the PRAM keyboard combination doesn't do anything and neither does holding down the programmers button while turning the machine on.

someone told me that I may have a corrupted ROM and that I need to flash it using a system 8.6 boot disk.
So I installed a spare drive I have in my Beige and installed 8.6 on it. Then I was able to find and download the ROM file from XLR8 your mac, so I figured I could get the process started on my Beige and then put the drive into the B&W so I can fire it up and have the OS flash the ROM but the ROM image will not allow me to install it on my Beige.

I am guessing that I need to perform this operation on a working B&W and then move the drive to my B&W to complete the operation, but that's not an option for me as I don't know anyone who has a working B&W sitting around.

So... I guess my questions are:
1) does anyone know of an alternate way I can flash the ROM on my B&W?

2) is the problem really with the ROM? or am I having a PSU problem?
all the green lights on the MoBo flash correctly so I don't think it's a power issue...

3) I suspect the problem is deeper than just the ROM but I'm not willing to buy a new MoBo for this thing, I just don't have the money.

please keep in mind that everything was working until I put the G4 in the Zif socket... The G4 is working fine in my Beige, I just want to take advantage of the 100Mhz. bus that the B&W has to offer.

I live in Alexandria, VA - if anyone local wants to help, I'll buy them a beer (or two).

thanks

Arthur G.

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
DanR's picture
Offline
Joined: Jan 28 2004
Posts: 48
Firmware?

The "open firmware" flasher is available from apple.com... the last for the B&W requires 8.6 IIRC.

There's also another firmware adjustment that allows it to run a G4... I got it from OWC's tech center.

Offline
Joined: Mar 12 2004
Posts: 57
G4 Zif problem

As quoted earlier, you need to flash the rom to "unlock" the G4 block in the G3 ROM...

If you install the G3 ZIF again, press the CUDA switch, to reset the motherboard. You should then be able to start up normally with the installed OS and run the flash program.

I have heard that upon flashing and installing a G4 ZIF in a G3 it is a good idea to press the Cuda switch again... to let the motherboard recognize the new ZIF as a G4.

Cheers!

BTW: I have done this process with my B&W, and after a few hiccups and CUDA resets, all worked fine. The flash program required 8.6 or BETTER, not ONLY 8.6...

Offline
Joined: Dec 19 2003
Posts: 38
My Beige G3 Does That Too..

Well, I had the same problem.. Only, I was not installing a G3 card. You have to trick the G3 into starting offa a disk. First, hold down the C key and try booting off of a CD. If that works, hold down C when there is no CD in the CD drive. When started, go into your system startup controls, and select your system folder again.

Good luck, that one stumped me for hours.

fmcat

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
no help...

I have a disk formatted and 8.6 installed.
the problem is the computer DOES NOT boot up!
it makes the BONG noise but then nothing...
no video, no disk activity, nothing
I have tried booting from CD and nothing happens.

is there a way that I can load the firmware onto the disk?
if so, how exactly???

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
no help.

I have put the machine back to the way it was originally. I have pulled every component (video, RAM, Hard Drive) and tested it in my Beige Mac and found everything works.

the problem is that I need to load/flash the ROM to get the machine to boot up. From what I understand the only way to do that is to install the firmware onto the diskdrive in another B/W and then pull the drive out and put it into the machine with the corrupted ROM.
Then press the programmer's button to get the new Firmware to load.

but the problem I have is that I don't have another B/W mac that I can use to build the drive that I need to load the firmware.

Does anyone know of an alternate way of loading the new firmware???
if so, exactly how?

thanks

Arthur G

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
any other idea?

I have tried to boot from CD by holding down the C key... it doesn't work on this machine.

Offline
Joined: Mar 12 2004
Posts: 57
ROM flashing problem...

I am sorry for my earlier post... I scanned your post, but didn't catch the details of what you had tried already!

Anyway, I tried to flash a G3 iMac a while back and the ROM didn't take... So I brought it into a Local Mom and Pop Mac Shop, and they fixed it for $40... Not too bad considering I had tried everything you did, with no results... When I picked it up and asked how he did it, he said; "is $40 really too much for a working Mac after all the time you spent trying to fix it? "

Then he smiled...

Cheers.

Offline
Joined: May 31 2004
Posts: 2
i'm having the same problem!

both of my beige and b&w died after trying to upgrade it with zif mercury from otherworldcomputing. it was running fine in my beige g3 until i put it in my b&w. then it broke both the b&w and beige g3.
i'm very much interested in the solution to this conumdrum.

Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 234
After you get the bong wait a

After you get the bong wait about 30 secs and press the reset button. My Quadra 800 weirds out sometimes and that seems to get it going.

__________________

The lazy man would rather exert himself than make two trips. -- Slovenian saying

Offline
Joined: May 31 2004
Posts: 2
where is the rom located?

is it on the motherboard?

Offline
Joined: Dec 19 2003
Posts: 566
Re: where is the rom located?

chino wrote:

is it on the motherboard?

yes the B&W G3 has it built into the motherboard ... the beige G3 has it on a SIMM ... the B&W (and all new Macs) also have a ROM image on the HD which they needs to boot ...

TOM

Offline
Joined: Jun 8 2004
Posts: 1
Having the same problem.

Hey Arthur. I'm having the same problem with a 350 G3 B&W. All was perfect until I tried to install the Sonnet Upgrade. No start up tone, monitor doesn't turn on, fans work, hard drive spins, and I tried using the CUDA. Were you able to resolve your problem?

Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 70
Did you....?

Just one question. Did you unplug the AC when you swap out the ZIF? If you didn't You may have fried the Mobo. I have the same thing happened to me a year and a half ago. The B&W PS is NOT completely off when you shut down the computer. If you swap Memory, CPU or PCI cards with it plugged in, you could fried the computer. Apple tech service note said to unplug the AC, I didn't listen.

BTW, A lot of the ATX PS on the PC world are the same. I have seen people fried systems when adding memory without unplugging the AC. The old day of "Turn computer off, keep AC plugged in, touch the PS case to discharge static" doesn't apply any more.

I still have that Rev 2 Mobo. Anybody interested in it?(I ended up buying a use Mobo).

Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 85
I can't believe no one ever

I can't belive no one ever suggested to reset the Open Firmware. If you hold down Command-Option-O-F at startup you should get a white screen with some text on it. Then you have booted into Firmware, and you can reset it, the instructions for doing this are on Apple's Knowledgebase website.

I can't believe people think their computers are "dead" after a failed processor upgrade, and then throw them out! Perish the thought...

__________________

~~~
tachyon
Wannabe modder without the carpentry skills.
Mac devotee since 1986

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
I give up!

I bought a MoBo from someone on eBay which turned out to have the same problem as mine does... other sources for new MoBos just want too much money.
Apple's support site is USELESS and I just can't afford to spend more money for a new Mac.

This is the second time I've had a Mac MoBo fail on me, and this is not the first Mac I've had that died, but it's going to be my LAST.

Anybody want a Dead B&W?
let me know NOW before I put it out on the curb as trash.

Arthur

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
nope.

Still dead...
Throwing it out, right after I have had a chance to gut it.
My PC could use some more memory and a second drive.

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
It's time to upgrade...

It's time to upgrade to a PC

Offline
Joined: May 13 2004
Posts: 8
how much?

how much for the rev.2 MoBo?

DanR's picture
Offline
Joined: Jan 28 2004
Posts: 48
:-/

I'd take that stuff, If you're just wanting to get rid of it.

There were some rev.2 B&W's on eBay for $185 last week. (I pretty much quit looking for just motherboards, they go for almost as much as the whole computer, although I do stumble across one occasionally).

Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 52
Message

You've got a PM.

Offline
Joined: Dec 20 2003
Posts: 70
I got it off Ebay, a while ag

I got it off Ebay, a while ago. I think I paid 85+shipping for it.

Offline
Joined: Jun 8 2004
Posts: 48
I want it.

I would like to get your dead B&W if it is still available. I would gladly pay you for it. I have sent you a PM also.

Offline
Joined: Mar 12 2004
Posts: 57
I have to speak up once again

I have to speak up once again about the niceities your local mom and pop apple store can offer... bring the B&W in and describe the problem.... My fix of a firmware update gone wrong cost me $40. All is well now. Is it worth $40 to you to get this machine working?

Cheers.