Mac OS X booting on a Centris 650.

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So you know how it is... if something can be done it should. Because it's there etc...

I have my Centris 650 booting Panther (10.3.4) at the moment. It's... taking it's sweet time, and I expect to see something recognisable on it within the next week *grin*.

it's using PearPC 0.3.1.

dana

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dankephoto's picture
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wiseguy eh? :D

Quote:

*grin*

{Curly)Wiseguy, eh?!? Knuk, knuk, knuk, knuk!!{/Curly}

{Moe}Why . . . you . . . !!!{/Moe}

Laughing out loud

dan k

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A little update

There's a bit of a running update of how the booting is progressing at:

http://www.appletalk.com.au/

After 4 and a half hours, it's partway through the text screen booting. Still limping along...

dana

Hokusai's picture
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Hmm...

Ha. I knew Apple was holding out on us. Didn't want us to know that we can go out and get a 'ole Quadra and run their shiny new OS on it.

On the other hand, even a Centris is running Mac OS X before my B&W is. That's sad.

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Oh... My... Goodness. At fir

Oh... My... Goodness. At first I just assumed you were just making a sarcastic joke about CherryOS or something- but unless I'm a big sucker, you really have it going!

I can't wait until your first spinning beach ball. It'll last days!

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Re: Hmm...

Hokusai wrote:

Ha. I knew Apple was holding out on us. Didn't want us to know that we can go out and get a 'ole Quadra and run their shiny new OS on it.

On the other hand, even a Centris is running Mac OS X before my B&W is. That's sad.

if you hurry up and install, you may get it up and running before this one boots Tongue

CCC

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Just a little update :).

Just a little update Smile.

The centris failed due to a bug in pearpc, but as luck would have it a patch for the that exact issue appeared on monday night. I've re-started booting, this time on a Quadra 605.

So far, it's progressing past the point it failed last time and in a lot better time. It may fail again some time, but if it happens it happens!

http://www.danamania.com/temp/909am.jpg is where we're up to.

dana

G4from128k's picture
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Panther-on-Pear-on-Quadra

Good luck with this amazing software hack.

BTW, did your server survive your mention on Slashdot last week?

Enjoy OS X on 68k.

doug-doug the mighty's picture
Joined: Apr 14 2004
Posts: 1355
Let me get this straight...

You are booting OS X.3.4, via PearPC on a Quadra?

Quick questions:
[*]Is this booting in OS X as a prelude to an install?
[*]What is the processor on you 605? Is it upgraded at all?
[*]have you done anything special (other than installing PearPC, and the aforementioned bug fix) to facilitate the boot?
[*]Size of boot volume?
[*]Currently installed memory?

--DDTM

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Thankfully it didn't direct t

Thankfully it didn't direct to my server, but to the article on appletalk.com.au about it. Unfortunately THAT didn't survive due to a misconfigured SQL server - one that's now fixed.

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It's a 10.3.0 image now, not

It's a 10.3.0 image now, not 10.3.4 - I created a smaller one that was much easier to handle (shifting files around over 10baseT isn't fun when they're multi GB fils Smile.

The 605 has a 25MHz 68040, overclocked to 33MHz (the original had a 25mhz 68LC040). There's 36MB RAM in the Quadra, and 1MB VRAM.

The boot volume is a Mac OS X disk image file of 1.5GB. It's an image that's already had 10.3.0 installed on it using PearPC on my Athlon - that's about the smallest drive size you can install Panther on. The disk image is on a Debian Woody (3.0) install on a 4GB SCSI drive. When it's finished booting it should drop to a plain old finder window and dock.

The only thing special is PearPC compiled from CVS source, otherwise everything else is just Debian 68k on a Quadra.

hope that answers questions Smile

doug-doug the mighty's picture
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Going to do a write-up?

I do hope you will post a detailed story when the dust settles. I have Quadra 950 and am fixing to drop a bunch of stuff into it. I was going to try to shoehorn in AppleShare IP 6 (but that requires 8.6 and I have no CPU upgrade card either. I would like to try this and would like to follow your example. I am at best about a month or two away from being ready to attempt this as I am going to have to build a backplane for the extra drives I am dropping in.

--DDTM

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'If it ain't broke, take it apart anyways. If you can't take it apart, break it so that you can fix it.'

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You're crazy to run OS X on a

You're crazy to run OS X on anything with less than 128 MB of RAM regardless of processor. The system is going to be paging like mad which will further degrade performance. I'd set up a second hard drive to be exclusively used for virtual memory in this scenario if possible. I have a feeling their would be a nice speed gain just from doing that.

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Re: You're crazy to run OS X on a

Kevin_G wrote:

You're crazy to run OS X on anything with less than 128 MB of RAM regardless of processor. The system is...

I don't think performance is a concern, here. Remember, a reasonable estimate is that at best this is OS/X on a 0.05MHz G3. That's 50 *kilohertz*. (The original Intel 4004 was spec-ed to run at 108KHz, for crying out loud.) Or to put it another way, this virtual machine is about 5000 times slower then the slowest thing OS/X officially runs on. Hard disk swapping isn't the bottleneck, here. The SCSI transfer rate of a Quadra is *well* above the virtual bus speed of the CPU.

(Of couse, it is open to question whether the hard drive this is running on will survive the experiment. It'll also be quite a compliment to Linux's virtual memory subsystem if it doesn't crash with a bus error or page fault at some point.)

Just think of it as OS X running on a drum memory machine from the mid-1950's.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drum_memory

---Peace

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> The system is going to be p

> The system is going to be paging like mad which will further degrade performance.

Not even remotely. It goes into a disk read/write fit for perhaps 30 seconds at a time every few hours as some swapped-out RAM gets swapped back in again, then worked on at a rate of kilobytes per second. Going by rough numbers the CPU processes 50,000 operations (say a nasty conversion to 50KB worth of instructions per second) when in that same second the HD can move 4MB worth of data about, it's an 80:1 speed difference in favour of the HD.

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Re: > The system is going to be p

danamania wrote:

> it's an 80:1 speed difference in favour of the HD.

Anyway, one thing I would say is a real concern: I hope you made the virtual machine's "RAM" large enough that Linux is handling all the overallocation natively. If OS X starts swapping inside the virtual machine, well... there exists the distinct possibility that booting could take years to complete.

So what is the progress at this point, anyway? Still sitting at the white apple? :^>

--Peace

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It has 128mb ram - enough to

It has 128mb ram - enough to boot to a finder and sit there, should it work.

Unfortunately the drive is starting to work up a really unhealthy whine. Apart from anything else that's REALLY ANNOYING for a machine on the desk next to me Smile. Otherwise it's still ticking away...

(update 40 minutes later: It's borked... I'm turning off cos the drive is just getting worse quickly. Still working, but by the sound of it there's a bearing with 15 minutes life left in it)

dana

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Noooooooo..... :D there is

Noooooooo.....
Laughing out loud
there is always a next time Cool Mac

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But for a 605 you can buy 128

But for a 605 you can buy 128 real ram! (google it) making a grand spanking 132M on your quadra. Get the onesided modules.

Hmm, still waiting for woody to base-install. 14 hours on 605 and counting, how long should it take???

Any cheap pram batteries out there (need 6)

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ooh ooh how do you do this? i

ooh ooh how do you do this? i have a quadra 605 - i wanna boot OS x on it! of course, i will have to wailt weeks for it too boot, but....

neg

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So, what's going on now? ;)

So, what's going on now? Wink

Bolle's picture
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Re: It's a 10.3.0 image now, not

danamania wrote:

It's a 10.3.0 image now, not 10.3.4 - I created a smaller one that was much easier to handle (shifting files around over 10baseT isn't fun when they're multi GB fils Smile.

The 605 has a 25MHz 68040, overclocked to 33MHz (the original had a 25mhz 68LC040). There's 36MB RAM in the Quadra, and 1MB VRAM.

The boot volume is a Mac OS X disk image file of 1.5GB. It's an image that's already had 10.3.0 installed on it using PearPC on my Athlon - that's about the smallest drive size you can install Panther on. The disk image is on a Debian Woody (3.0) install on a 4GB SCSI drive. When it's finished booting it should drop to a plain old finder window and dock.

The only thing special is PearPC compiled from CVS source, otherwise everything else is just Debian 68k on a Quadra.

hope that answers questions Smile

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Someone should try it with an

Someone should try it with an SE/30. That would be the oldest mac that could run debian... Smile

I wonder if NetBSD would boot on an upgraded Plus. You can upgrade the plus to an 030, but it loads an extension to put the onboard processor in dma slave mode so that the 030 can take over. Once its taken over the booter might work...I might have to try that...

Upgrade a 128k to use SCSI and 4MB of ram, then 030, then boot OSX. Seems logical to me...

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does your centris have a cd-r

does your centris have a cd-rom drive?

with a nice little app called bootcd you can make images with a bootable macos x on them that are smaller than 700mb and so they fit on cd.
so you don´t have to use the 10base/t to swap the files and the system is smaller and it takes less time to boot.