ADTPro IIgs question

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
Posts: 21

Hello,

I pulled my old IIgs system out a couple of days ago and set it up. I have limited software for the machine (all old II and not gs software), and would really like to transfer some more disk images to disks. I have both a 5.25 drive and a 3.5 800k drive on the machine. Inside, there is a modem card on slot 2. Also, I have two external modems and cables to connect them. Can any of these things be used to transfer images?

I have what is a null modem cable too. On one end, there is a standard parallel serial connector, which plugs into my pc (25 pins) and on the other end there is a plug that fits into either the modem or printer port on the back of the IIgs. I believe this is all I need to use ADTPro?

I installed ADTPro on my Dell PC and followed the instructions. I have the cable set to com 1. I tried com 3, but the status bar wouldn't progress at all in ADTPro, so I'm thinking I use com 1. So I got to the command prompt in the IIgs, typed, IN#2. Then I select bootstrapping, ProDOS, then send ProDOS. Then I type Control-A which is supposed to bring up an SSC prompt, where I type 14b. Well, nothing happens. No SSC prompt.

Do I have everything I need to make a transfer? The ADTPro website isn't very clear. Do I need a "super serial card" or is that only for II models before the IIgs? I think that I can just use the IIgs's built-in modem port capabilities.

So does anyone have any experience with this? I'm dying to get software onto the IIgs to see what it can do. If I can't use ADTPro, will any of those modems (the internal or two external) be of any use in transferring disk images?

Looking forward to a reply and so glad to have found this website,

Richard

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Joined: Apr 11 2006
Posts: 1013
Re: ADTPro IIgs question

richdet wrote:

Also, I have two external modems and cables to connect them. Can any of these things be used to transfer images?

Yes. Not the modems, though: just the built-in modem port on the back of the GS.

richdet wrote:

I have what is a null modem cable too. On one end, there is a standard parallel serial connector, which plugs into my pc (25 pins) and on the other end there is a plug that fits into either the modem or printer port on the back of the IIgs. I believe this is all I need to use ADTPro?

Correct.

richdet wrote:

Do I have everything I need to make a transfer? The ADTPro website isn't very clear.

Sorry about that; there's a lot of ground to cover with all the various Apple II computer types out there.

richdet wrote:

Do I need a "super serial card" or is that only for II models before the IIgs? I think that I can just use the IIgs's built-in modem port capabilities.

This section talks specifically about connections with the IIgs; go through it carefully. There's a couple of things you're going to need to do since you have a card in your slot 2, and so your control panel probably has slot 2 set to "my card":
http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#MiniDIN8

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
Posts: 21
Thank you for the great respo

Thank you for the great response!

I can pull the card out if need be. In the control panel it does say slot 2 modem. Any settings that may have been made on this years ago don't seem to have held, since the onboard battery is long dead. I'm glad to know that I have all I need to make a transfer!

Maybe it will work if I take that card out, but otherwise, I don't know what else I could be doing wrong. Maybe I should try a lower baud? And should I use the regular ADT or the ADTPro?

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
Posts: 21
Nope, not working :( Nothi

Nope, not working Sad

Nothing happens when I hit control-a, other than the "?" which appears as it is supposed to for the IIgs. But then it won't let me type "14b". It's like num-lock is off or something. It just sits there with the "?" sign. So I don't think I'm able to receive any data. I've tried sending from two windows computers and a linux computer. This is really frustrating.

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Re: Nope, not working :(

richdet wrote:

Nothing happens when I hit control-a, other than the "?" which appears as it is supposed to for the IIgs.

Ah, but something *does* happen. It's waiting for your input.

richdet wrote:

But then it won't let me type "14b".

Yes it will. After you are done typing the B, you'll notice that the question mark goes away. That means it has accepted your command. Things you type on the GS' internal serial port aren't echoed to the screen the way they are with the SSC.


It may be the case that your cable is the opposite type that it needs. The ADTPro site talks about "printer" vs. "modem" cables; yours may be the wrong type. Armed with a voltmeter and the pinout on the site, you could find out for sure. Does the cable say anything on it of use? Printer vs. Modem? Or does it have any icons on it?

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
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Thanks for the response! T

Thanks for the response!

The serial end has no icons at all. The IIGS side has an arrow which points toward the IIgs. I do have another serial cable that I found. The serial end has an apple on it, and the other end has the printer icon. However, the serial end on this one only has 6 pins for some reason...three in one group, and two in another.

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Re: Thank you for the great respo

richdet wrote:

I can pull the card out if need be. In the control panel it does say slot 2 modem. Any settings that may have been made on this years ago don't seem to have held, since the onboard battery is long dead.

Yep, it's definitely back to a stock configuration then.

richdet wrote:

I'm glad to know that I have all I need to make a transfer!

Well, maybe not, based on your later comments. The cable might not be right. Also... you're plugging into the left-most serial port on the GS, correct? The one with the phone icon above it?

richdet wrote:

Maybe I should try a lower baud? And should I use the regular ADT or the ADTPro?

Nope, a lower baud rate isn't going to help. It's likely an electrical issue now - the pins aren't connected the way we expect, one way or another.

You can use either ADT or ADTPro - both will support the GS. Plain ADT won't be able to transfer your 3.5" disks, though. And both have the same electrical requirements - if one doesn't work, the other isn't likely to either.

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Re: Thank you for the great respo

david__schmidt wrote:
richdet wrote:

I can pull the card out if need be. In the control panel it does say slot 2 modem. Any settings that may have been made on this years ago don't seem to have held, since the onboard battery is long dead.

Yep, it's definitely back to a stock configuration then.

richdet wrote:

I'm glad to know that I have all I need to make a transfer!

Well, maybe not, based on your later comments. The cable might not be right. Also... you're plugging into the left-most serial port on the GS, correct? The one with the phone icon above it?

richdet wrote:

Maybe I should try a lower baud? And should I use the regular ADT or the ADTPro?

Nope, a lower baud rate isn't going to help. It's likely an electrical issue now - the pins aren't connected the way we expect, one way or another.

You can use either ADT or ADTPro - both will support the GS. Plain ADT won't be able to transfer your 3.5" disks, though. And both have the same electrical requirements - if one doesn't work, the other isn't likely to either.

Yes, I've been using the port with the little phone icon. Just to see if it would make a difference, I set the printer port to modem and used in#1 instead, but it made no difference.

Hopefully these cables aren't too difficult to find Sad I really wish there were some way to just plug the disk drive into my PC. I realize this is impossible though. I've been wanting IIgs software for like 5 years now, and piddle with the system every now and then, but it never works out Sad

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Joined: Dec 11 2008
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Sorry to butt in, but I've go

Sorry to butt in, but I've got a similar situation. I tried last night with ADTPro on my desktop Power Mac G3 and IIgs ROM 03. I'm using an Apple StyleWriter cable as a connection. The connection is OK since I can use the OS X Terminal to echo strings like this to the IIGS screen:

echo "hello" > /dev/tty.modem

And that will make hello appear just fine on the IIgs screen. However, ADTPro seems to send gibberish to the GS. I have tried setting the baud and other settings, but still no luck.

The version of ADTPro is the most recent 1.2.2 version and OS X on the G3 is 10.2.8.

(Actually, I typically use AppleTalk to connect the G3 and GS together. I'm messing around with ADTPro for personal interest!)

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Re: Sorry to butt in, but I've go

Dog Cow wrote:

...And that will make hello appear just fine on the IIgs screen. However, ADTPro seems to send gibberish to the GS. I have tried setting the baud and other settings, but still no luck.

Gibberish does sound like a baud rate problem (as opposed to the OP's problem, which sounds like it's electrical in nature.

You say you changed baud rate settings - have you been changing them on both sides? If you change the server side, it'll have a different Ctrl-A sequence to type in on the GS side (for bootstrapping operations).

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Re: Sorry to butt in, but I've go

david__schmidt wrote:

You say you changed baud rate settings - have you been changing them on both sides? If you change the server side, it'll have a different Ctrl-A sequence to type in on the GS side (for bootstrapping operations).

Thanks for the tip. I will verify this evening and see if I can get it to work.

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
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I went ahead and purchased a

I went ahead and purchased a new cable online. Now I just have to wait for it. Really, really hope it works...

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Joined: Apr 11 2006
Posts: 1013
Re: I went ahead and purchased a

richdet wrote:

I went ahead and purchased a new cable online.

Do you know if it's got the right pinout as defined here?
http://adtpro.sourceforge.net/connectionsserial.html#MiniDIN8

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I didn't check first :/ Ho

I didn't check first :/

Hope it works.

It says:

PinOut: 4,20-1 / 5-2 / 2-3 / 6-4,8 / 3-5 / S-S.

http://www.cablesdirect.com/prodimages/CC506-06_LR.jpg

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Re: I didn't check first :/

richdet wrote:

I didn't check first :/

Hope it works.

It says:

PinOut: 4,20-1 / 5-2 / 2-3 / 6-4,8 / 3-5 / S-S.

Ooops. No, that's a "modem" cable. You need a "printer" cable (Apple's term for a null-modem). You will also need a null-modem adapter in addition to this cable.

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Posts: 21
Ugggg.

I think that's the cable I already have then. Do you know where I can inexpensively purchase one of these?

So what I'm looking for basically, will have the printer cable IIgs input on one side, which leads to a small serial plug (which looks like a vga monitor cable) and then I need an adaptor to take this from the little serial to the standard com bigger 25 pin serial? Is there somewhere in my community I could purchase this (such as Radio Shack or something), or do you think these have to be purchased online? If online is the only option, do you know where I could purchase one cheaply? I believe I've seen the information listed on your website before, but I can't find it.

Thank you again for all your help!

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Do any on this website look s

Do any on this website look suitable?

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Posts: 21
http://www.bestcableforless.c
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Nope - 2-3 and 3-5 (DB-25 to

Nope - 2-3 and 3-5 (DB-25 to MiniDIN8) connect Tx and Rx directly. They need to be swapped. (2-5, 3-3)

I sell some that I make myself. They might be out of your desired price range, but they have the advantage of being wired correctly:
http://retrofloppy.com/products.html#DIN8DE9

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
Posts: 21
Would it be possible to just

Would it be possible to just switch those two lines inside the cable?

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
Posts: 21
http://retrofloppy.com/img/ii

http://retrofloppy.com/img/iigsNullModem3.jpg

So I need this. Is the serial end male or female? I can't tell. If it's male, can I just plug it into the smaller serial out on my PC, or do I need an adapter for the 25 pin kind? Do you carry this adapter?

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Re: http://retrofloppy.com/img/ii

http://retrofloppy.com/products.html#DIN8DE9

richdet wrote:

So I need this. Is the serial end male or female?

It is a female DE-9. You'd need to look for a male 9-pin DE-9 connector on the back of your PC. If you have a PC with a 25 pin adapter, it's probably not serial - it's parallel, and not at all compatible with what you're trying to do.

If your PC was manufactured in the last 5 years or so, it may not even have a serial port on it at all - you may need to go the USB route.

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I have the male 9-pin DE-9 co

I have the male 9-pin DE-9 connector on the back of my 2001 dell desktop, so I should be good to go Smile

Cable purchased!

This is the port that the computer refers to when it mentions com 1 - com 4, right? LPT1 would be the parallel?

Really hope this works Smile

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Posts: 1013
Re: I have the male 9-pin DE-9 co

richdet wrote:

I have the male 9-pin DE-9 connector on the back of my 2001 dell desktop, so I should be good to go Smile

Yep, that's old enough.

richdet wrote:

This is the port that the computer refers to when it mentions com 1 - com 4, right? LPT1 would be the parallel?

Right on both counts. I'm going to drop a floppy of ADTPro in the mail too... that should simplify matters for you.

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Joined: Mar 31 2009
Posts: 21
Thank you so much!

I really appreciate all your guidance!

I'm really interested in a program called SoundSmith. I can't get any IIgs emulators to work on my computers (which are all PCs running linux), so I haven't been able to try it out, but it seems like it will allow me to do neat things with the IIgs' synthesizer chip.