Prosecuting Steven Landon

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Tom Owad's picture
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Google searchers: Please note that in the U.S. there are at least 32 people by the name of Steve Landon. This is Steven Thomas Landon of Isabella County, Michigan. Brown hair, blue eyes, 5' 9", 205 lbs, born 11/11/1981. - Tom

I have received yet another complaint from a user ripped off by Steven Landon. The purpose of this thread is to gather information so that he might be prosecuted.

Aliases:
Phoenix Computers
RavenDarkness
Doctor Zoidberg
imacman
captiankirkstone
ihardwarehack
Fleet 7th
NX01

Email addresses:



AIM: Stevenlandonnx01
Yahoo: fleet7th, drzoidberg1703
ICQ: 91879015

Location: Clare, Michigan

If you've had any dealings with Steven Landon, please post details below.

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Reverend Darkness's picture
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Address and phone #?

I have been given a potential address and phone # for the enigmatic Mr. Landon, but the phone is giving an "unavailable" recording, and I think the address is a bus station (I could be very wrong about that, though).

If anyone has any emails from him, I would ask that you forward them to me with the full headers. The closer we can pinpoint this son of a motherless goat, the better chance we have of actually nabbing him.

Oh, and Steve-O, if you're still browsing around here, reading this, I want you to pay attention to the next few words very carefully.

Run. Run fast, run hard, and don't stop 'til you're in Canada. As long as you are in the States, I will find you!

[lightning flash/thunderclap]

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Tom, you forgot the current e

Tom, you forgot the current e-mail he has on file:

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eeun's picture
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Cheese it, da cops!

As stated before, I'd contacted the Chief of Police of Clare, MI before it was discovered RavenDarkness was Steve L.

Chief of Police: Tim Rynearson, email: trynears(_at_)glccomputers.com

There's nothing he would be able to do until someone is going to bring official charges, but if any of Steve's victims are prepared to take that route, Chief Rynearson is the person to contact.

Also, if any of you out there happen across Steve in IRC as has happened before, please let Tom or ReverendDarkness know about it.

Oh, and Rev...Canada doesn't want him

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doug-doug the mighty's picture
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one requested tale of deception...

Details for Mail fraud are outlined at the following address:

http://www.usps.com/websites/depart/inspect/usc18/mailfr.htm

Here is my story. On July 17, 2004, I mailed one eMate 300 to one S. Landon of Starbase Computing in Clare, MI. The agreement was that he would pay shipping costs only (that was at my invitation). He confirmed that he would send money as agreed. I confirmed on August 1, 2004 that he had recieved the package via PM. I also inquired as to the money. He indicated that failure to send the money by that time was an oversight and being corrected immediately. I have yet to recieve anything. Grant it I had no expectation of making money on the deal, just wanted to see it go to a good home, he did not hold up his end of the agreement.

Based on USPS Title 18, Section 1341, S. Landon has devised a scheme to defraud me of property (one eMate 300) by means of false pretenses and promises (agreeing to pay for shipping costs), thus causing said property to be delivered by the United States Postal Service (sent Priority Mail).

This section also provides room for commercial and private interstare carriers, meaning if you sent something to him via DHL, UPS, or Fed Ex, you should be covered as well.

I have forwarded a copy of my shipping info to Tom Owad for reference. I have also sent info on a possible alias not mentioned in the original post for this thread.

--DDTM

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What kinds macs does he sell?

What kinds macs does he sell? old, new, laptops, desktops? I would like to be sure and keep an eye out for him at Powerbook Central, but i would like to know what things hes "sold" in the past

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In the old forums
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was he also the Dr. Zoidberg

was he also the Dr. Zoidberg from AF 1? http://www.applefritter.com/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.pl?action=viewprofile;username=Dr%2E_Zoidberg Or was that another guy.

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Oh, Hazel, look. The field! It's covered in blood

Quad 2.5 G5, MBP 2.6 17", DP 2.7 G5, Mini 2.33, MBP 2.16 CD, DP 2.0 G5, DP 1.42 MDD, 17” PowerBook 1.67, 12" PowerBook 1.5, TiBooks 1GHz 867 & 667, iMac G3 500, Cubes 500 & 450, B&W G3 450 & 350, iBook 300's, 366 466, Beige G3 350, PDQ G3 233

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took my iMac

Hello there,
I figured I had been scammed....for me that's a loss, I'd like to strangle that SOB right about now... I saw the Bus stop information when I did mapquest, he got my Rev A iMac, as a student I can't afford much, and he got what I had...he promised me a Duo 230C among other things...if someone does anything... let me know..I'll be more then happy to help out any way in frying this guy in the courts that I can....by the way, MacBoyGeeThree is also a possible Alias

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Re: was he also the Dr. Zoidberg

GEOS wrote:

was he also the Dr. Zoidberg from AF 1? http://www.applefritter.com/cgi-bin/YaBB/YaBB.pl?action=viewprofile;username=Dr%2E_Zoidberg Or was that another guy.

thats the very one!

TOM

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I also wanted to add that I w

I also wanted to add that I wrote to the United States Postal Service's fraud protection agency and have forwarded all avalible intel about this fellow...I shipped his item UPS and I DO have a tracking number.

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so, he had 2 accounts on AF1?

so, he had 2 accounts on AF1?! how did he get away with that? seems to me he had a lot of nerve coming back to the site he scammed people on. heck he's been here doing this under 3 names! no one thought to stop him before?

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Oh, Hazel, look. The field! It's covered in blood

Quad 2.5 G5, MBP 2.6 17", DP 2.7 G5, Mini 2.33, MBP 2.16 CD, DP 2.0 G5, DP 1.42 MDD, 17” PowerBook 1.67, 12" PowerBook 1.5, TiBooks 1GHz 867 & 667, iMac G3 500, Cubes 500 & 450, B&W G3 450 & 350, iBook 300's, 366 466, Beige G3 350, PDQ G3 233

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Sherlock!

Sherlock - Why do you think he's had to keep coming up with new identities?

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Here's the address I was give

Here's the address I was given for him:

Steve Landon
Phoneix Computing
436 W 5th Street
Clare, MI 48617

I sent him a Pismo, among other things. I've got a signature of S Landon from FedEx so I know he got it. If this is the bus station address how is he picking this stuff up??? Does he sit there all day waiting for deliveries, work there, got something going with the drivers?

Before this discussion came up online I sent him details on the FedEx claim I filed (he claimed things were damaged) to the same address. Today I got a letter stating that FedEx wants pics of the boxes and damaged contents, I don't know if there's any point in sending a request for that onto our bus station vagrant, but if I do at least I've continued to try to remedy things; its only $0.37 more.

At this point, I think I'd be willing to press charges.

*** Tom - I lost the password to my account here under the username tbannon040. The email address under that account is one from my old ISP which i can no longer access so I can't retrieve the password automaticly. I've got a few RavenDarkness pm's I'd like to print out under that username ***

Tom

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I'm With you!

I got the same speech about how UPS Destroyed this classic iMac I sent and it was in pieces... he supposedly took it and put the logic board into a setup to run a server....a Rev A iMac running an OSX Server of all things... anyhow it IS a bus station, I checked the address as well, that's the one he gave me and I know he got it, tracking number and all. When you do press charges, tell me if there is any way I can help you, I am upset greatly.

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I've got a feeling this guy is really good at making errors

Yeah, he must have a nack for making errors, like these two I found in his profile which would make me assume he knew a lot more about macs than I know he does (having at one early time tried to contact him about selling a mac, thank god it never went through.)

Quote:

CustoATX Beige G3 Tower w/ Panther DT Beige G3 266 w/ Panther

Yep, there we go, one more error he made. He has also been known to go under the AIM SN imacman, and he might have a new one, I'll do some investigating. Good luck catching this guy, I can tell ya first hand you shouldn't need it, considering how dumb he is a lot. (He's also a heavy drinker IIRC... Fun fun fun)

(Yes I do know about XPostFacto3, but knowing his skill level, there's no fricking way.)

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The dirt...

Here's some of my old PMs that I dug up from the old AF. I shipped him a somewhat tricked-out PowerBook 1400cs and was supposed to get a Wallstreet 233 in return. All free, we each pay shipping on our ends.

Quote:

Sunday Is fine.  yeah USPS Parcel Post is fine,  just make sure you pack the box good cause the last thing i got from USPS was messed up, I will ship sunday too
 
heres my address
Phoenix Computers
c/o Steven Landon
14062 N. Cooper St. Apt 15A
Newberry, MI 49868

This was the first PM... we agreed to ship Sunday, then I needed an extra day and asked him, he was apparently fine with it as evidenced by this next PM:

Quote:

Monday is great heres my address
 
Steven Landon
Phoenix Computers
14062 N. Cooper St. Apt 15A
Newberry, MI 49868

I didn't have the 3 GB HD ready for him, so I loaded up the stock 750 MB one and said I'd put the 3 GB in the box...

Quote:

yeah go ahead and put the 3 gig in the box and,  i will manage to get it working,  also can you burn me a copy of os 9 so i can install that on it or whatever latest version of os 8 you have.  I will have the wallstreet out tomarrow via usps parcel post.

When I asked how he got all of this stuff...

Quote:

theres an apple computer recycling center in canada about an hour from here,  everything is 5 bucks canadian a truckload

-Wallstreet- and I were getting suspicious cause neither of us had gotten our stuff as promised. When i asked why he hadn't been on AIM or shipped Wallstreet's stuff...

Quote:

i have been on aim i cant be on after like around 11 cause my gf gets home and the computer goes off,  his stuff is here waiting to go out,  cause he never gave me his address i thought he did and then i stopped myself b4 i shipped the box to the wrong address lol.  its been a long week brain is gone

And finally...

Quote:

still no 1400 showing up,  Im giving till tuesday if it dont show up i would like the wallstreet shipped back when it arrives.

That's all I have. Good luck finding this a** hole. I've written off my 1400, but the mere thought of him getting off on scamming people is just horrible. I feel sorry for those who lost iMacs and G3s. Wallstreet and I lost a 1400, Duo 230, and Dock II between the 2 of us.

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How long ago was this?

How long ago was this? It'll help if I have a timeline when I contact the apartment complex...

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I lost my iMac to him approxi

I lost my iMac to him approximently 3 weeks ago....I thank you for your condolences...as for that Duo, it's ironic... I was promised a Duo 230C that was at one time 'his brother's"..

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I got ripped off too

I lost my souped up beige g3. We were supposed to do a straight swap for his b&w g3 400 "kit". We were supposed to ship on the same day and exchange tracking numbers, although I never got one from him. He claimed that he sent it via USPS.
After my computer arrived, he claimed that it had been damaged in shipping due to my poor packing job. He said that he put a hold on delivery of my computer until we completed the UPS claim process. As soon as he got it, he tore it apart and made all kinds of mods to it. The last time i heard form him was Aug 3, when he asked me to start the UPS claim process again.
The address he gave me was the same one in Clare Michigan, and he never gave me a phone number or e-mail address.

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Interesting...when I do a rev

Interesting...when I do a reverse address search for the Newberry address, it comes up with the town Pentland as being listed for that ZIP code.

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He and I had been discussing

He and I had been discussing this trade since Mid-July. I shipped a package to him 7/27/04 and he apparently got it 8/02/04. My last contact with him were several PMs back and forth on 8/03, with him lisiting all the problems with what I sent him.

He claimed he was leaving for his "vacation" on 8/03.

I repeatedly asked him to contact me via email since it was easier to keep track of and he never did; guess that's so i would have less info on him.

Am I the only one up for bringing charges against this guy? I'm hesitant to do it, only because I have no idea how to proceed.

Tom

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My parents live "in the booni

My parents live "in the boonies" like S.L. claimed he did. They are close to the city limits of at least 4 different towns, but they are listed as on county land and have an address linked to one town because of the E911 service. The person behind them is listed as a different town, but I'm not sure if their ZIP codes differ. I'm kinda guessing they may, but either one could easily claim that they are a part of a third town that they are closer to than wither of the ones they are listed for in the mailing records. I know the P.O. will deliver based on ZIP, even if the listed town is wrong, but close. Listing Clair my have been more "convinient" for S.L.

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doug-doug the mighty's picture
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Count me on on charges...

...once we collect all the info on this guy, we can then formalize something.

--DDTM

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do we have an operative?

remember in the P-P-P-Powerbook thread? there was someone near enough to go and scout things out, do we have someone who can do that here? open call for volunteers - I will check my off-site contacts to see if anyone is close to that area.

--DDTM

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Damn AIM. I had been talking

Damn AIM. I had been talking to him on anf off on aim until i got enough info, I thought aim could log stuff..but i got confused with trillian, so i lost it all. Damn.

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Re: Damn AIM. I had been talking

sourapple wrote:

Damn AIM. I had been talking to him on anf off on aim until i got enough info, I thought aim could log stuff..but i got confused with trillian, so i lost it all. Damn.

are you using the official AIM client? ... if so it stores logs in your prefs folder ... in OS 9 it was in "/Preferences/AOL Instant Messenger (SM)/Users/[username]/Logs/" ... ive never used AIM in OS X but im sure it will be something similar ... maybe "~/Library/Preferences/AOL Instant Messenger (SM)/Users/[username]/Logs/"?

TOM

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Address from 7/22

Okay, I won't go into detail about almost losing a ColorClassic to him (see my other post in this forum), but here is the address he sent me on 7/22 via PM:

Phoenix Computing
436 W. 5th Street
Clare, MI 48617

--John

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Mr. Landon tried his best to

Mr. Landon tried his best to steel my 8100, I had to get lawyer and everything but in the end he sent it back(in pieces)but i got it back this is the address he gave me

The Computer Mill
1108 E. Bennett St.
Mount Pleasant, MI 48858

Not to mention that a money order was also sent to him at that address.

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My Story...

Reverend, that apartment address was from just under 10 months ago. I got the same story that it had been destroyed by UPS. The trade was a Duo 230 and Dock for a bunch of 6100 upgrades. Every time we PMed, the specs of the things he was going to trade me changed. I should've known....

Here's the PMs: (I had put up a WTB ad for 6100 upgrades)

He initiated the transaction with this (9/27/03):

Quote:

have everything you need here,  I picked up a 6100 loaded with a g3 upgrade,  AV PDS Card, HPV Card,  and 72MB RAM Total.  I will strip parts if need be.  im always accepting trades,  so let me know what you got.  Oh yeah theres also a 5gig hard drive in it.

Then he said this (9/28/03):

Quote:

I'll take the duo and the duodock,  i'll give ya the ram,  the g3 upgrade card and the video card.  i'll even toss in a 2 gig hd.  
 
heres my shipping address
Steven Landon
14062 N. Cooper St. Apt 15A
Newberry, MI 49868

I responded (9/28/03):

Quote:

You are a very generous person. I am very grateful.  
 
I'll send it out ASAP.
 
Thanks so much!

Then he PMed this (9/28/03):

Quote:

do you still got that 1400si sitting around,  cause i might be willing to let ya have the wallstreet for it.

I responded (9/28/03):

Quote:

Sorry, it went to a friend of mine. But about the trade for the Duo and Dock, I think we should both send then at the same time. Which day do you think we should pick? Do you think tomorrow would work? If you can, get on AIM so we can talk there. I'll be on for a little while.
 
Thanks!

He reponded (9/30/03):

Quote:

stuff got shipped usps should be there in a week
 
steven

I responded (9/30/03):

Quote:

Greatness! I'll let you know when your stuff gets shipped (I'm trying to find a box that it'll fit in...
 
Thanks so much!

I then proceeded to mail his stuff out.

Then I got this (10/10/03):

Quote:

I recieved the duo this morning and its totally dead it wont power up or nething,  i have tried 2 diff power bricks and still nothing
 
 
just thought u should know
 
steven

I responded (10/10/03):

Quote:

Have you tried the power button on the back of the Duo?

He responded (10/10/03):

Quote:

yeah i have,  nothing,  i put it in the dock and it doesnt even power up

I responded (10/10/03):

Quote:

You're obviously missing something. It worked *flawlessly* when it was here. Are you sure you're using the right adaptor? It's supposed to startup as soon as it's inserted into the dock, and if it doesn't try the power button on the back of the dock. Keep me updated...

He responded (10/10/03):

Quote:

yup,  im doing everything right,  i have a PowerBook Duo AC Adapter from my old 230 thats on it.  and still nothing,  and then when i put it in the dock i get nothing but the mouse cursor

(Funny how it went from not booting at all to only booting to a cursor...)

I responded (10/11/03):

Quote:

Hey Steven, my sincere apologies about the HD. Another 80MB one will be in the mail ASAP, but unfortunately your little brother will have to wait for his gift.
 
Sorry!

(He had told me through AIM that it was going to be for his little brother for his birthday)

Then, as if I wasn't being generous enough, he adds this (10/11/03):

Quote:

hey make sure you send me a disk of system software too,  and if ya got one a scsi terminator so i can use my external cd rom

While all of this was going on, my friend (he doesn't want me to use his name but he's icebook1 from these fora) was also in the middle of a transaction with SL. Once he realized he'd gotten scammed, I didn't send anything else. I talked with Steven online many times asking why my stuff wasn't showing up and each time he made up different excuses, and each time I could tell that he was lying because he'd tell me something else that'd prove it. Like the first time he said he had no money and would send it as soon as he did, but then he'd go off telling me how he was going to buy weed and liquor the next day and then get lit, or how he was going to go pay some hookers to get in bed with him because he'd just broken up with his girlfriend. He also said stuff like he was in the process of moving and didn't have the time to send it. Then he said his car was stolen and he couldn't get to the post office. He kept going on and on and I eventually just gave up. If there's anything else I can do to aid in his prosecution and conviction, just let me know.

-Chris

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a memory

I just realized looking over his previous alias I've had dealings with him in the past...does anyone remember when he claimed he was seeking a Saab sports coupe? at that time I saw pictures of his set up...he's got rooms filled with macs as I recall...he's been at this a while I think

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Saab is Swedish

I've never seen that topic or the pic, but would certainly like to see it! Perhaps I can pick out my (well, Chris' really) 1400 and my Duo 230 and Dock that Chris sent him... the 1400 is/was blue and white, not all that hard to miss.

Oh, and for now name wise, I can stick with AK. It's a long story that nobody would understand unless you're in my band. Has nothing to do with the weapon, but it's short and actually has something to do with my real name (i.e. put a single letter before and after the AK and you're there)...

Chris & I got scammed at the exact same time. Funny thing is Steve (I don't think) made the connection that Chris & I live 10 minutes apart and talked every day about our transactions with him...

Oh well. Let's keep this up - hopefully we can get somewhere!

AK

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How long ago was this?

BlackScorpion,

How long ago was this? I'm trying to set up a timeline and location map to track this little punk...

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lol, Im on a PC, not a mac.

lol, Im on a PC, not a mac. My parents wont buy a mac, but allow me to. Smile

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It all started on 12/23/03 an

It all started on 12/23/03 and the money order was sent on 4/14/04.
I have all the e-mail transactions every excuse he could think of and finally on 3/24/04 he sent me this e-mail:

Dear Sir.. The reason the 8100 was not shipped was my
grandfather passed on of cancer. I have not been
around to recieve any of your emails until now. So I
have been dealing with that. As for the 8100, I am
gathering everything that everyone has sent to me and
getting it all ready to ship back to them. Please let
everyone that you have recieved emails by to email me
with there address so I can ship the items back. Once
I recieve emails I will begin shipping Immediately.
Send your address in the reply email and the 8100 will
be sent out USPS parcel post. I cannot ship without
an address

So as you can see he has acknowleged to doing this to more than one person.

This is the thread that started my inquiry,

http://www.applefritter.com/node/view/1604

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He's been around the web for

He's been around the web for awhile at least. I did a google groups (old usenet archives) search on his name and came up with posts dating back to 1995. No mention of theivery in the ones I checked but several on Macs, modifying a Chevette (seriously a Chevette, really, i'm not kidding, i mean it, really) and other things that seem to fit with our Mr. Landon.

Do we have a real address for this guy yet? He likes getting packages, maybe he should get some more...dead fish, severed horses head, ect..

T

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Re: He's been around the web for

tmbannon wrote:

...Do we have a real address for this guy yet? He likes getting packages, maybe he should get some more...dead fish, severed horses head, ect..

T

An interesting read on internet scams, and sweet sweet revenge.
www.p-p-p-powerbook.com/

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QT200

Hello..

I while ago, on the 68kMLA Forums [I'd have to look up all my stuff on this, but I've got Posts, emails, and AIM transcripts]
I was supposed to trade him a QT200+AC+Cable [which was going bad] - for a 2x, a 4x [SCSI], and a 16x ATA Burner

he never shipped anything, he said that he got the QT working by making a new cable - but later when I demanded he send it back, cause he didn't ship the stuff, he told me that "his girlfriend broke it in a fit"

later on AIM he said he would send me some other USB pen cam thing [of course he didn't send that either, and it wasn't worth as much as the QT]

Once I talked to him about fileing a small claims court case against him, but he said that I'd have to go instate to do that [and that him and his Dad had been there a lot, and the local judges wouldn't help me Tongue ] [living in Oregon, and not having $ to fly/drive to MI, I was resigned to helping as much as I could if someone instate filed against him]

feel free to email me, or message me on AIM [I try to leave it open all the time]

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sourapple's picture
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this post is so long its almo

this post is so long its almost freezing ie.

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Posts: 67
Filing a claim

I've a couple friends in the legal sector and they've offered their assistance, however I need to figure out if I can file charges despite not being in the city itself, if I can, one of them has offered to do notify the claims and thus have them submitted, thus if anyone knows about the law pretaining to prescience to press charges let me know, if I can do it from here, I ask we assemble everything we have so I can turn it over to them. Sometimes it pays to be friends with Lawyers.

Update: I wrote the Chief and am awaiting response, we'll see what he has to say, I'm prepared to nail this SOB if we can get restitution or at least our equipment back

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Detective

Well, the chief of Police finally wrote back, here's his response to my letter:

GOOD MORNING DAVID,

WHAT I WILL DO IS TURN THIS INFO. OVER TO MY DETECTIVE. WE AT THE POLICE
DEPARTMENT ARE VERY AWARE OF MR. LANDON.

I'LL HAVE MY DET. ( BARRY BABCOCK) GET BACK WITH YOU ON THIS ISSUE.

T.J. Smile

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MacTrash_1's picture
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I never had any dealings with

I never had any dealings with the loser but we have another hurricane heading for central Florida and it's a good time to go on a trip.

Anybody wanna throw in on a plane ticket to MI ?

I'll make sure he NEVER EVER types on a keyboard again. I'm sure he doesn't have any friends so that will make sure he never rips-off anyone on-line again.

Cool

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woogie's picture
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Posts: 267
An Idea...

Why don't you download and send a copy this thread
to the Police Department? It would show that more
than just you got ripped off and might motivate
them a little more.

BTW...Who is "T.J."? The Chief's initials are T.R.
Just wondering.....

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woogie's picture
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Posts: 267
Whoa buddy.....

We need to keep things civil here. Especially now.
Apparently the police are involved in this and
credibility, details, and civility are the most
important things now. Especially if any of this
is entered into evidence during the investigation.
You all want your stuff back or restitution. You
all want (and deserve) a proper resolution to
this situation.

As another poster said, there should be no threats
or mentions of reprisals. This will only complicate
things. Let the police handle things and help them.

I took the step of deleting another similar post
here along the same lines. I know the individual
personally and so he has heard from me face to face
about this. He actually agreed and there is no prob-
lem. He was just trying to show support, but I
advised him that was the wrong way to do it. All
fixed.

We should really try to maintain some "coolness"
while dealing with this.

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Wise words, Woogie.

After all, it's not like he knocked up your sister or mugged your mother. The total value of the good lost to the dirtbag is continually adding up, but I don't think anyone has lost enough to warrant inflicting bodily harm on the guy. Whether the cops catch up with him or not, he'll get his due.

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Posts: 67
Agreed

I'm going to go ahead and look back through my posts... see if I can remove some of the intensity I have entered, I think that's very much a valid point, if we help the police, we must do it without showing any sort of material that might be deemed offensive

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If one really wants to track someone down . . .

locating their family is almost always a useful approach. However, please don't take my post and comments here to suggest they should be harrassed or anything. Quite the opposite, they haven't done anything wrong (AFAIK.)

Steve's father co-founded a snowmobile magazine, The Winning Edge.

-- Data removed by Blackstealth --

Interesting what google will turn up, ain't it?

dan k

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Harrassment

If I find out anybody harrasses these people, they'll be banned.

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davintosh's picture
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And considering how Mr. Lando

And considering how Mr. Landon has alienated people here, it's possible, even likely that he's done the same with his own family. They may have no idea where he's at nor what he's up to.

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Posts: 1900
re: Harrassment

Contacting the parents isn't harrassment until and unless they ask to be left alone. At the very least it is reasonable to ask them if they have current contact information for SL jr. If they refuse and/or ask to be bothered no more then there should be no more attempts at contact. If anyone does get any negative response from them please be sure to add that info here.

Based on SL jr's own comments here and elsewhere, he appears to be a troubled person suffering from chronic depression (his own description) at the very least. His family may or may not have an interest in assisting him. If they are not aware of the trouble in which he may be in then informing them of the issues swirling around him may (or may not) be of interest to them.

I gotta point out that it's not a good idea to speculate about SL, jr's relationship with his family as one may open oneself to potential liability.

dan k

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