What do you think will drive the value of 2 series systems in the future?
Will it be rarity through attrition? By that I mean consoles will fall into hands of unknowledgeable folks that simply push stuff around on ebay like this:
And in the process of moving around and sitting in piles of junk, the systems become more and more damaged and scuffed up.. to the point where it's really worthless except as spare parts.
Or will it be some rave hip factor? Having one of these ancient systems next to a modern 32 core laptop. Just too cool!
Perhaps it will be something else entirely?
And what will happen when the current generation dies off, will the next gen be even interested in garbage like this?
I think what you really have right now is the people who used these systems as a kid wanting a bit of nostalgia.
Sure there are some collectors and speculators, but I think that's what's mostly driving it.
Is there any easy way how to determine what the factors are? For me, it certainly is that. All the good times of BBS programming, and warez, and writing basic programs that would simulate interplanetary navigational computers. Things like that.
I did not buy my first Apple II (a IIc) until 1985. I was 32 years old. I am now 59.
I have been hooked into Apple's ever since in one way or another (either the II's or the Mac's).
I collect, tear down, refurbish, clean, and use every one I've bought so far.
They are simple to restore and easy to use. The software is simple and easy to use.
I have told coworkers that I can make just as good a document using an Apple IIc, Appleworks, and an Imagewriter II printer, as they can with any new computer currently being used.
They are gems of a simpler time of computing.
I would also like to see some hacker try to infect my IIc with a Virus.
I think that you think too way much about how much they are worth to auction off and not enough about what they mean to you.
I bought 1/2 Interest in a 64K, Single Drive, Un-Enhanced Apple//e in NOV-1983.. I was 17 1/2.. Apple ]['s were my main Machine until SEP-1987, when I jumped to an IBM-AT Clone.. I still have all my Old Apple stuff, some at my Parents, some with me.. In just the last couple months I have been acquiring Apple ][ stuff, it brings back all those High School Computer Memories.. I am real glad to see all these other "retro" Apple ][ fans, who remember and relive the Old Days..... I still need to find all my old Manuals....
Well, lets see I'm 21 now so I wasn't even around when the A2s were current. Now I have a ][+ set up right next to my iMac also have a //e a C64 and a TI Computer...and I built the Briel A1 replica. Yes, LOL I am interested in garbage like this!
in mathematical description the so called "market" is set to the formula:
(general price ) divided by ( availiable units ) multiplied with ( willing to pay customers )
so the less availiable units the higher the price - the more customers the higher the price
the less amount of availiable units and the more of willing customers the higher the price....
this law is valid to everything availiable in trade-market....
nothing else to say about it...
dumping availiable units or units destroyed or loss by damage reduce availiable units and drive price high...
units not in care or losing shape or out off operating condition also reduce availiable units....
so for example a printer card ( sold 10.000 units sold at $100 and 6000 killed and 4000 remaining ) and 500 customers =
100 ./. 6000 x 500 = 8,33 virtual value ( and that card is for sure not a "very rare item"! )
palburning card sold at $ 2000 and only 100 sold items 80 dumped or killed 20 remaining:
2000 ./. 20 x 500 = 50000 virtual value ( thats for sure realy a "very rare item" ! )
the card in the last example had been sold less times than an AppleII (!) so that card could become more expensive than an Apple II
- but due to the less people willing to buy such a card again presses price value down ( less willing customers )... so to demontrate that lets set the willing customers down to only 20:
2000 ./. 20 x 20 = 2000 virtual value ....
the examples just for demontration purpose....
I would think making them rarer always drives the price up. So an EMP pulse, that would kill off 25-30% all of the Apple II-IIgs would cause to drive the price up. Of course no one would be buying the untested ones of anything from certain regions that were affected.
Next would be the demise of the Apple corporation, followed by the passing of the Woz. If he was using a II at the time there would bonus points.
Like you I wasn't a kid when I got my first Apple II (II+) in 1981. I was 23, I'll be 54 in May. The II+ was recommended to me by a friend. It replaced the TRS-80 (Model I Level II) that I had at the time. Like you I've been using Apple ever since. I also agree that with the right software, Appleworks, Publish It!, etc. and an Imagewriter II printer documents on the Apple II can look just as good as anything put out with any current system.
I think what appeals to me about the Apple II is the amazing job programmers did writing excellent software that used a very small amount of RAM. With systems now most software is bloat-ware, the attitude seems to be "lets throw everything in there including the kitchen sink and if they don't have enough RAM to run it they'll just go buy more".
I've got 4 Apple II's, a //e, //c, //GS and my latest acquisition, a //c+. I bought them to use not to think about their possible re-sale value down the road. I'm having more fun messing around with the Apple II's again than with either of my Macs.
I agree to both posts....
lets view just for example to one programm:
Word under CPM=> 240 kB on one SS/SD Floppy....
Word Vers.3 for PC => 496 kB distributed on 5 Floppies ( each 360 kB )with intall of the correct printer
Word for Windows 1.0 => 830 kB distributed on 7 Floppies ( each 360 kB ) s.a.above....
Word for Windows 6.0 => 3,2 MB distributed on 8 DS/DD 3,5 Floppies !
the reason for the explosion of software RAM usage is related to the fact that lot of those guys that call themselves "programmers" in fact work with "Program generators" that pack in each software package tons of ready to use libraries and the fact that only the smallest part of those libraries bundled in that package is realy used ( less then 5% ! )
god bless the lazy guys that never realy learned programming.... they blasted the RAM-market and the spill of RAM-usage...
I still do my stuff by myself at the apple with Aztec C or with Pascal and time critical parts of the apps with assembler... and those programs run at the 6502 with 2 Mhz faster than at a Pentium 4 with 2,8 Ghz !!!
And the RAM-usage is less then 2% that would be needed at the Pentium !
And the best of it all: 10000 lines of program always contain before first proof at least 40 mistakes per 1000 lines....
after first proof-run 80 % of this mistakes are solved and taken away...
after second proof-run its bugfree....
has anybody ever seen anything from microsoft that had been bugfree after 200 proof-runs ???
dinosaurs like us say: "don´t buy anything from microsoft unless service pack 3 is availiable...."
if you don´t take care of that your just an unpaid employee abused as "costfree beta-tester" -
because thats what the customer is to microsoft - and nothing else ...
I like that back in the day, there was much less versioning of software. And when it did come out, it was to fix a serious bug, or give you a whole new experience.
today we have software patched on a weekly basis it seems!
Using them as a kid is what got me started in collecting older computers, especially macs.