Apple IIc shows no color on screen

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Apple IIc shows no color on screen

Hello Friends of the good Apple II,

i have obtain a Apple IIc and i get no colour picture on screen. We have here PAL TV Standard. I tried the Pal Modulator with the 15 Pin Connector and through the RCA Connector. I get all times only a b/w picture without any colour. What can i do? My TV supports NTSC and PAL. I thought that it maybe a NTSC Apple IIc but the Label says 220-240 Volt, so i guess thats a PAL type.

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Re: Apple IIc shows no color on screen

Hi Are you located in Europe or Australia ? Most probably you have a PAL Apple IIc. Unlike the US Apple IIc which is NTSC and outputs color composite video signal, the PAL Apple IIc RCA video output is only b/w. The 15 pin connector can give color but only through TV coaxial tuning signal, and provided the TV modulator used is truly a PAL type, not the US NTSC TV modulator. Cheers.

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Thx for answering. Im located

Thx for answering. Im located in Europe.

"the PAL Apple IIc RCA video output is only b/w" would explain why RCA shows only b/w. But i have a PAL modulator for the 15 Pin Connector and it also shows only a b/w picture. Is there a switch or Option like in the old IIe ????

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Re: Thx for answering. Im located

I'm not aware of any video switch on the IIc but if you do have an original Apple IIc PAL RF modulator that's great, those are actually pretty hard to come by nowadays. To have color you should have the modulator plugged into the TV antenna connector at the back using a coaxial (antenna) cable. *** Plugging to the TV yellow video input instead will show only b/w picture ***. Then do an automated channel scan on your TV to have it tuned to your Apple IIc. Another solution for color is to use an IIc 15 pin to SCART connector (eg. french le Chat Mauve modulator). One last solution since your TV supports NTSC is to simply get an NTSC (US) Apple IIc : the RCA video output on those display NTSC color and correct image ratio straight to the TV video input, no need to use a modulator.

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Thanx. I found out that only

Thanx. I found out that only high res graphic are without colours (basic programms shows perfect colour). If i try to run Games like Maniac Mansion or California Games, they are without Colour and they look like "bad printed" with missing lines. But thats a phenomen i have with my Apple IIc and my Apple IIe, both shows the same Problem. I tried to search through Google but i found no solution.

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Re: Thanx. I found out that only

California Games and Maniac Mansion use double hi-res graphics and so when in monochrome display will definitely look awful (see pictures below), be it on a IIc or IIe. Did you try tuning your TV to the RF modulator or are you already getting colors in simple hi-res mode ? What do you mean by 'basic programs showing perfect color' ?

IMAGE(http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/7631/calgameslhd5.jpg)

IMAGE(http://img514.imageshack.us/img514/7640/mmansionloq5.jpg)

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And why these Games are witho

And why these Games are without colour?

Programms like "Apple presents Apple" are in colour and they look good. I get colour with these Program through the normal RCA jack on the Apple IIe, but the games look like you shown in the pictures above. I tried the IIc through Modulator and i get only the same pictures as shown. No colour and with these missing lines.

Whta can i do to see them in colour?

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Re: And why these Games are witho

And why these Games are without colour?

These games (and others like Airheart and Black Cauldron) use Double Hi-Resolution Graphics mode (DHGR). What revision is your Apple IIe computer, A or B ? I think only Apple IIe equipped with Revision B motherboards could display these double-hires graphics properly (using an internal video switch). As for the Apple IIc, it's possible your RF modulator can't handle DHGR and will only output b/w. I'll give my own Apple IIc modulator a check to see if it can display colors on TV. Or maybe DHGR requires an RGB monitor and will not work correctly with TV display.

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DHGR works with regular TV's/RCA cables

DHGR works with regular TV's and RCA cables, and the composite Apple II video monitors.

Mutant_Pie

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With my Modulator PAL it won

With my Modulator PAL it won´t show the DHGR Colour. Through RCA Jack there is defintive no colour (i tried on various TV PAL and NTSC).

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DHGR and Apple IIc PAL/NTSC

After making a series of tests with DHGR display (I used DAZZLE DRAW) on different Apple IIc computers (American NTSC IIc and Euro PAL IIc, with PAL and NTSC modulators and various TV multi-standard displays), here's what I get :

DHGR on NTSC IIc + RCA Video Jack + NTSC TV = color
DHGR on NTSC IIc + NTSC Modulator + NTSC TV = color

DHGR on PAL IIc + RCA Video Jack + PAL or NTSC TV = B/W
DHGR on PAL IIc + PAL Modulator + PAL TV = COLOR (!), but only if the upper output jack is used (using the lower one gives B/W).

Testing with Hi-res (HGR) display gives the same results, so it's probably not a software issue related to DHGR, more like some hardware malfunction.

Perhaps your PAL Modulator isn't working correctly or maybe it isn't like the one I used. Check for the back label on your PAL modulator, what Model No. is it ? The Model No. for the NTSC Modulator is A2M4020.

If I can get hold of a digital camera I'll try to put up some pictures later.

Cheers.

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The Model No for my PAL Modul

The Model No for my PAL Modulator is A2M4020, the Part N. 825-0830-A
The Apple IIc Computer Serial 2A2S4-018624.

So that the NTSC Modulator has A2M4020 can´t be correct. Mo one is a PAL Modulator/Adapter and has A2M4020.

I tried it once again with a PAL / NTSC TV and only b/w screen through Composite and Modulator.

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Your Apple IIc is PAL, but your Modulator is NTSC, *NOT* PAL !

I get it now. You're actually using an NTSC Modulator on an Apple IIc PAL, no wonder it shows no color on screen and makes DHGR look so bad. The two hardware pieces aren't compatible together : to get color display you will need either an NTSC IIc computer or a PAL Modulator/Adapter. Other alternatives are to get a special color display adapter for the IIc (French chat mauve, video-7 enhancer).

NTSC A2M4020
IMAGE(http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/9013/ntscmodge8.jpg)

PAL A2M4023
IMAGE(http://img376.imageshack.us/img376/3001/palmodzu8.jpg)

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I don´t know. It is written

I don´t know. It is written PAL on my Modulator, not NTSC. And how do you get that my Apple IIc is a NTSC one?

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Re: I don´t know.

It is written PAL on my Modulator, not NTSC.

Perhaps it refers to the TV output system signal. Because the IIc was intended to be a portable personal computer, your modulator would make it possible to bring an NTSC Apple IIc from the US to Europe and connect it to a PAL TV, and still get color display (however the power voltage is different, 220V not 120V). So maybe the modulator you have is still meant to work on an NTSC Apple IIc, not a PAL Apple IIc.

A2M4020 P/N 825-0817-A "Modulator" => NTSC TV output.
A2M4020 P/N 825-0830-A "PAL Modulator/Adapter" => PAL TV output.
Both A2M4020 modulators are for use with an NTSC Apple IIc.

A2M4023 "PAL Modulator/Adapter" => PAL TV output, for use with PAL Apple IIc.

And how do you get that my Apple IIc is a NTSC one?

You can't change your PAL Apple IIc computer (model #2A2S4) to an NTSC Apple IIc (model #A2S4000), unless you change its logic board.

Anyway did you connect your PAL Modulator to the antenna input at the back of the TV and tuned the channel to it? You need to use a different cable plug for that, not the usual RCA video jack cable, so don't connect it to the TV's video input. If you did that correctly and it still doesn't show color on screen, then most likely your modulator is not compatible with your Apple IIc.

This is just me, but I prefer using a green monochrome monitor when using my Apple IIc. I almost never use TV color display because graphics looks fuzzy and text display smears heavily on screen.

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You are joking? A different c

You are joking? A different cable for Antenna ? I see the light.......... Smile

Im not stupid. I checked it in various Ways, all TV´s i found in our House. No colour with the Apple IIC and the PAL Modulator. Maybe i have to look for another Modulator. But i think the Modulator is damaged, the Screen looks very fuzzy.

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Maybe the Modulator is malfun

Maybe the Modulator is malfunctioning badly. But about your PAL Modulator, did you buy it in Europe, along with your Apple IIc or as part of a add-on IIc accessory ? The NTSC US Modulator has a channel 3/4 switch on top of it and was sold together in a Kit with a TV Switch box and a video cable.

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No i bought it from a flea am

No i bought it from a flea amrket. The Modulator has a adjustment screw on the Top where you can slightly change the MHz Channels.

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No i bought it from a flea am

No i bought it from a flea amrket. The Modulator has a adjustment screw on the Top where you can slightly change the MHz Channels.

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Very interesting.

Very interesting. Your Modulator looks similar to the PAL Modulator A2M4023 I used to get color on screen, it also has the adjustment screw on top. Do you also have two outputs from the left side of the Modulator like shown on the second picture above ? I will try again with my PAL Modulator and take pictures so you can see how it shows color on screen with a PAL Apple IIc. There is still hope.... Smile

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No it has only one output on

No it has only one output on the side for the RF Cable.

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How to get TV color display with PAL Apple IIc

Hallo I'm glad it's the weekend, this took some time to accomplish but here it is : my tutorial on how I got color on TV screen (DHGR) with my PAL Apple IIc, step-by-step.

IMAGE(http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/7696/lo1dsc01633we4.jpg)
#1. Everything I need : PAL Apple IIc, PAL Modulator, special home-made cable and TV (not shown).

IMAGE(http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/6362/lo2dsc01634yl6.jpg)
#2. I plug the silver jack of the cable to the Modulator (upper output)

IMAGE(http://img60.imageshack.us/img60/109/lo3dsc01635po9.jpg)
#3. I plug the Modulator to the 15-pin connector of the Apple IIc, I tighten the screws.

IMAGE(http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/8466/lo4dsc01641hf6.jpg)
#4. On the other end of the cable, I plug the white jack to the back of the TV (antenna connector).

IMAGE(http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/7537/lo5dsc01636vn7.jpg)
#5. I turn the Apple IIc ON and boot Dazzle Draw. On the TV, I do an automatic scan of all channels to find the Modulator signal.

IMAGE(http://img60.imageshack.us/img60/9015/lo6dsc01639zt0.jpg)
#6. After a moment, the TV tunning finds the correct PAL signal and shows Color. Success! Smile Channel is saved.

IMAGE(http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/9528/lo7dsc01640vn8.jpg)
#7. Dazzle Draw Slideshow : the Double Hi-res Graphics Tool. This looked so cool back then (less now).

IMAGE(http://img374.imageshack.us/img374/7885/lo8dsc01637dj3.jpg)
#8. Dazzle Draw (c) Broderbund Software, By David Snider.

Hope this helps. Good luck! Let me know your questions or if you succeed. Apple II Forever!

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Hi, would be great if my P

Hi,

would be great if my PAL Modulator has 2 Outlets. But my one has only one RF Output for TV. And there is absolutely no colour. We checked it today at the DoReCo Computer Meeting, and no one knows how it is possible that no colours are shown from the IIc. www.doreco.de

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I think I know now. Your PAL

I think I know now. Your PAL Modulator cannot show color with a PAL Apple IIc. Its only purpose is to give TV display for the Apple IIc on a TV screen (for people who don't have a monochrome monitor back then and use their TV). Maybe it is an early version Modulator with no color function yet, and a second outlet was added later on with color function.
btw great retro computer site. Macintosh XL. Nice.

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Apple //c shows no color on screen

I know your original question is a little over a year old but I thought I'll still post an answer.

My Apple //c is also an European (in my case a Scandinavian) version and as we have the PAL standard, I guess my machine is also a "PAL machine".

I bought my Apple somewhere in the late eighties. It came with the Pal Modulator Adapter model A2M4023 which has two outputs. Many years ago whenever I had the chance to use my apple with a color-TV, I used the upper output of the modulator (I didn't have a TV of my own). I actually never got a chance to test the lower RCA output connector but it just was revealed to me that the lower one is a composite PAL video output which could be used with a colour monitor or a television through for example a scart adaptor cable (direct video, not RF output to a TV-antenna connection).

It also seems that this particular PAL adapter/modulator A2M4023 is VERY RARE and to have one is very fortunate. I also have those other type of modulators that have only one connector but they would not serve my purposes as seen for example here in my YouTube videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jrXCXFjzzpA

and:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnMRLd-jiwM

(the second video shows the type of picture that can be seen without the appropriate two connector PAL modulator/adapter directly from the composite video connector built in)

What a revelation it was also to me after all these years that I had had a treasure in my hands.

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