Saturn 128k

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DevMcLin's picture
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Saturn 128k

Hi
next problem with my Apple II+
There is a Saturn 128k card installed in slot 0. But if I start Apple works the message pop up 128k is need. Any tips for me?

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Re: Saturn 128k

Did you test the card for proper operation?
That card should work with no issue. IMHO, that's the
best legacy memory expansion card for the Apple ][.

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Re: Saturn 128k


next problem with my Apple II+
There is a Saturn 128k card installed in slot 0.

Wait, if the 128k card is in slot 0, then how do you get the last 16k of memory to get the base up to 64k? Do you have a memory chip plugged into the socket (in the RAM area on the mainboard) where the jumper to the 16k card usually goes? Does the Saturn card documentation say it will backfill that last 16k if you don't have it?

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Re: Saturn 128k

Hello DevMcLin,
i´m sorry, but i´ve got several bad news for you.....
first: the 128k Saturn is not usable within Appleworks......
in fact this card can only operate as RAM-Disk.....
the reason: When Appleworks was written the code assumed to be used on Apple IIe with 80 col. card with memory in slot 3 - in the special slot so called "auxiliary slot" ( not the one in the row with the others from 0 to 7 ) but instead to the slot set apart in front towards the keyboard.... the memory in that slot is managed by the MMU chip on the mainboard and it handles the switching of the RAM blocks ( each 4 kB ) in another way than the RAMcards do in the regular slots ( they map the softswitches for switching the RAM blocks in the unused areas above the slots and below the gameport - there is a area that is a copy of the cassette interface ) .....
second: at least no Appleworks up till vers. 3.01 is not able to even recognize such RAM-Disk cards

and only few other cards that have been working in that area ( like the 1 MB card from Cirtech - the PlusRAM card ) only could be working with Appleworks if the Programm disk had been patched prior to use with the card.

Under normal conditions Appleworks only recognizes RAMexpansion in the special auxiliary slot where the 80-col card is inserted.... even the engineers had tough negotiations till the programmers of Appleworks recognized the need to accept at least a recognition of RAM in the auxiliary slot - which caused much extra coding.... and only starting upward with at least vers. 3.01 the very first cards from third party developers like AE started to be recognized....First real complete integration of AE cards like RAMworks II and RAMworks III started with Ver.4.0.

But the Saturncard offers Operation as RAMdisk under all 4 OS... DOS, ProDOS, CP/M and UCSD Pascal.

For more information goto my page:
http://www.harrowalsh.de/Elektronik/APPLEBOX/appleboxdownload.htm
at the very bottom of that page several cards are listed with links to the manuals and the requested utility disks.

And in fact it is recommended to keep Languagecard in slot0 and Saturn card in any other slot from 1 to 7 where it may be treated like a diskdrive...

sincerely speedyG

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Re: Saturn 128k

If you get the message that 128k is needed then you have a version of Appleworks for the IIe/IIc. Your Saturn 128k card in slot 0 is only going to work as a 16k card.

Appleworks 1.3 and earlier were able to run on an Apple II Plus with 64k, 80 column card and shift key mod. Any version after 1.3 would normally require a IIe/IIc. I say normally because there are so many patched versions of Appleworks out there.

Posting which version of Appleworks you’re trying to run would help a lot.

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Re: Saturn 128k

Ok, thanks for the replies. So I understand without an 80 col card I don't need to try other Apple Works versions.
So if the card not usable as ram expansion, I think its worthless for me, and I'm looking for an 80 col card with ram expansion.

Which card did you prefer?

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Re: Saturn 128k

That is dependent from the fact if you are looking for the Apple II+ or europlus or for the Apple IIe.
Different computers - different slots - different recommendations....
sincerely speedyG

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Re: Saturn 128k

I just have the Apple II+

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Re: Saturn 128k

the only card i can refer to by own experience that is working with AppleII+ and Appleworks is the PlusRAM card from Cirtech. But take care Cirtech also offers another RAM card too - only for the Apple GSII !

But you need the Utility Disk and it works with Appleworks Vers. 1.3. With the Utility Disk you then can
patch the Programdisk and then you will have 1 MB availiable within Appleworks. The card also permits to work with
KIX and Pinpoint.

probably other user at this platform have additional recommendations to cards with own experience that they have made with.

sincerely speedyg

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Re: Saturn 128k

There weren’t any 80 column cards with RAM expansion for the II+. That was a IIe upgrade.

There were a lot of different 80 column cards and most should work fine. The most common one was the Videx cards. Being the most common, pretty much all II+ software should work with them.

Your Saturn card should stay in slot 0. You pretty much need something there to give you 64k. AppleWorks 1.3 will utilize the Apple memory card. Another maybe better choice might be the RamFactor from AE. AE made software to patch all the early versions of AppleWorks to use the RamFactor. AE sold a lot of those cards so one shouldn’t be too hard to find. Software should be easy enough to download. Here one site
http://ae.applearchives.com/all_apple_iis/ramfactor/

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Re: Saturn 128k

There weren’t any 80 column cards with RAM expansion for the II+. That was a IIe upgrade.

There were a lot of different 80 column cards and most should work fine. The most common one was the Videx cards. Being the most common, pretty much all II+ software should work with them.

Your Saturn card should stay in slot 0. You pretty much need something there to give you 64k. AppleWorks 1.3 will utilize the Apple memory card. Another maybe better choice might be the RamFactor from AE. AE made software to patch all the early versions of AppleWorks to use the RamFactor. AE sold a lot of those cards so one shouldn’t be too hard to find. Software should be easy enough to download. Here one site
http://ae.applearchives.com/all_apple_iis/ramfactor/

Just a resume:
we´re talking about II+ not IIe.... so only the RAMfactor is option -
not the RAMworks - they are for use in the auxiliary slot of the IIe !
In the II+ only Apple RAMcard and PLUSRAM from Cirtech do the job with Appleworks..... But i haven´t seen tha Apple RAM Expansion card in action with Appleworks on a II+ - so i can´t ceritify that - but i´ve used the PLUSRAM in a II+ and know that it works...
and of course besides in slot 3 a regular 80 column card would be required !
and the Saturn card as option to replace the languagecard ? well i´d be pleased if you can show me that option explained anywhere in the manual ! I have 2 saturn cards by myself, but there is not a single word about such option in the manual....
speedyG

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Re: Saturn 128k

If we were talking about the IIe then none of this discussion would be going on. Any extended 80 column card would have solved the issue.

Around here the Cirtech cards aren't very common but RamFactors and Apple memory cards are. I usually recommend the easier to find hardware over the rare.

You may not have tried the Apple memory card with Appleworks but Apple computer made both the program and the card and they say it works. I'd think that would be good enough.
http://support.apple.com/kb/TA29204?viewlocale=en_US

It's on page 6 of my Saturn manual. You can download a copy of it here
http://www.apple2online.com/index.php?p=1_20_Hardware-Manuals

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