AF Old Guard

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Blackstealth's picture
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AF Old Guard

Just stopped in, as I've been known to do from time to time, to check on the state of the 'fritter and I'm wondering if I'm stuck in a timewarp? Posts last updated in years rather than minutes, hardware hacks stagnating at G4s, software questions about OS 9. Think we'd better have a sound-off of the old guard, make sure you're all still breathing out there Wink

I myself have been lost out in the wilderness for a while but my first Apple purchase since 2003 brings me back into the fold...

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Present

Just came back after a long while, too.

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!

'ello!

I still pop in on occasion.

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Not sure to what extent I cou

Not sure to what extent I count as "old guard", but hello. I don't check in here all that often these days; mostly over at 68kmla.

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Hmm

Yea, its been a long while since I last posted here. Haven't done much 'hacking' or other out-of-the-ordinary work on my Macs since I upgraded from my 'ole G3.

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I am with DrBunsen on not kno

I am with DrBunsen on not knowing what you consider as old guard, but being a member since mid to late 2005 (not nearly as long as most). But i come on here daily to see what activity is going down at the fritter (if any).

There hasn't been much activity here lately I was sort of wondering the state that Fritter was in myself.

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Still alive, and still here a

Still alive, and still here a lot.

Haven't done any Mac hardware work since the MDD conversion, though I did have my LC475 out recently. I also found I still had a Quadra 630 in the crawl space that I was keeping around for a Colour Classic conversion. Too bad I no longer have the CC.

Mostly working on Atari hardware these days, and making a VGA adapter for a Dreamcast I dumpster-dived.

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times have changed

Maybe, Macs just weren't fun anymore after the G4's. They were nice, but not fun. Even the G4 iMacs weren't any fun. There was a sea change when the G5 arrived, and now the Intels seem like love'em and leave'em. I've had the same experience in photography. Now that digital is well entrenched, it's just not interesting anymore. Everyone can own it, everyone can do it. I hardly touch my cameras now, but I used to love to run around finding shots to take. I look at my friends' photos and they're (almost, haha) as good as mine. Not a special experience anymore. There's something similar with the new Macs.

Quadra 630 in a CC? I'll have to look that one up. I've been keeping my eye out for a Performa 575 for the CC I found a couple months ago. I'm kicking myself for not picking up a 575 that this guy was throwing away a year or so ago. It was sitting on the side of the road, but when I got out to grab it, the guy was standing right there in his yard and looked at me with a slight scowl and said, "you don't want that," so I left it to be polite. When I drove past the next day someone else had already grabbed it.

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Going to have to agree. Somet

Going to have to agree. Something has been lost, along with the loss of "Computer" from the maker's name. Asthetic and hip took precidence over rock-steady, reliable and a joy to maintain.

I got a slew of Macs that a local school gave away, and so my mind wandered back here...

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Older and not so bitter!

I dunno I dropped out of here because I was being a dick on all of the forums I was on and needed a reset. When I checked back in, nobody was really posting anymore.

It's the same across the net. People have left their websites and yahoo groups and forums empty. Can't help but wonder if it's Facebook's fault.

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I don't know if I count, but...

Still checking, now and again.

It's gotten mighty quiet lately. I'd attempt to do something about that, but... years pass, things happen, priorities change, and spare time becomes a rare and precious commodity. I'm coming to realize I should find new homes for the remaining few antique computers I've held onto because I know, in all honesty, I'm never going to play with them again.

If only getting rid of them would magically give me more time rather than simply more space... sigh.

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Sounding Off!!!

I usually check in here and A2Central at least once a week.
Sometimes I post, sometimes I don't. It all depends on what is going on.
I found a new job and started last week, so I don't have the time on my hands that I did while laid off, but I'm revamping several of my IIe Platinums and several IIc's to keep busy on the weekends.

I've put my Classic, Color Classic, G3, G4, and G5 Mac's aside for right now, but I'll get back to them eventually.

I pondered getting an Intel Mac, but (you will have to excuse me for saying this) isn't that almost the same as buying(HEAVEN FORBID) another PC? Smile

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Arcade Cabinet

Think I am going to make an arcade cabinet with one of these old iMacs inside of it. Seems like the most natural use of one, as long as the software is up to it (which I'm sure it is.)

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iMacs

Macinjosh, what I've done with a few CRT iMacs is sell them as a kid's computer setup. The iMacs that my daughter's school gave me already were running OS 9 with some kid's software already installed--Kid Pix and Thinking Things, etc. and when I'm at Goodwill or some other thrift store I'll check to see if there's any old kid's software I can pick up too. There always is--old Jumpstart, Reader Rabbit, etc., that are compatible with OS 9 which I can pickup for @ $1 each. The ones to get are for pre-K through 2nd grade. OS 9 is a good OS for young children. I'll check to make sure the iMac is running well and has no symptoms of dying soon and then I put it up on Craigslist packaged with the kid's software disks and sell them for $65--$80. They always sell very fast. It's not much money, especially for the time spent, so it's more about just not throwing a good machine away and seeing it go to good use for a little while longer.

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Re: iMacs

Hawaii Cruiser wrote:
Macinjosh, what I've done with a few CRT iMacs is sell them as a kid's computer setup. The iMacs that my daughter's school gave me already were running OS 9 with some kid's software already installed--Kid Pix and Thinking Things, etc. and when I'm at Goodwill or some other thrift store I'll check to see if there's any old kid's software I can pick up too. There always is--old Jumpstart, Reader Rabbit, etc., that are compatible with OS 9 which I can pickup for @ $1 each. The ones to get are for pre-K through 2nd grade. OS 9 is a good OS for young children. I'll check to make sure the iMac is running well and has no symptoms of dying soon and then I put it up on Craigslist packaged with the kid's software disks and sell them for $65--$80. They always sell very fast. It's not much money, especially for the time spent, so it's more about just not throwing a good machine away and seeing it go to good use for a little while longer.

Flat-out good idea. Going to grace a few little ones in my family with a few first, but believe me there's no shortage of the things. Lord, did I ever end up with too much computer stuff. (When I say it's too much, it's TOO MUCH!) Smile

I'll poke around for software there, excellent call.

Also, far as I know our DNR has a deal worked out with Goodwill so that I can take the not-working stuff to them. I hate to do that, but at this point, my workshop is stacked to the brim with so much stuff, I can't even go in there. I don't even know where to start sorting, it's ridiculous.

The wife tells me that this is what I get for wishing for more computer stuff than I know what to do with. She says it with a smirk and a glimmer in her eyes though, and I know just how to take it. Smile

So yeah, I agree! Let them get used. I'm typing this on one of them, definitely has taken me back.

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I check in here every few mon

I check in here every few months.

I dont do much with my computer hobbies anymore. Over the past couple of years I gotten involved with a local nonprofit and with power lifting. So that eats up a lot of my time.

I've still have my Macintosh IIsi and Apple IIe. I haven't done anything with them in a long time. I keep them as I hope to get some time for them someday.

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Am I old guard yet?

Am I old guard yet?

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Re: Am I old guard yet?

cwsmith wrote:
Am I old guard yet?

Member for 4 years. Probably so.

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You're old guard if...

You're old guard if you were on the old AF forum.

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guess that's me too

I was amused to see my topic about dressing up a Pro Mouse is apparently the last updated topic on the old site.

dan k

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I look around here pretty reg

I look around here pretty regularly still, about once a week - but I don't post much anymore because I'm not doing much hacking. Same as Eudi, retrouteone and others - no time these days, and life goes on... also, I agree w/others that 68kmla seems to be a bit more active. I find that strange, because 6-7 yrs ago when I first joined up, AF seemed like it'd have more staying power.

But it's still great to browse these forums and see what folks are posting about.

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I've been a lurker for a long

I've been a lurker for a long time. It seemed like everything just dropped off suddenly. I didn't realize how long AF has been a part of my life... I just dug around the old site and found I had registered in August of 2001. I've definitely seen a lot of good Apple discussion happen...

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Hmm...

I didn't know that was still around to this day.

By the way, I noticed a big drop-off in activity back then when it switched to the new one. I don't know if that was just me or what. Its been a while.

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Every so often

I still read the RSS feed, and check out the thread if I see anything that piques my interest. Honestly, I just find that I don't have a lot to contribute. I've been in university the last few years, so all my hardware lives in storage. My software is all stuff for newer systems.

When I do touch hardware, it's something like an Arduino, so I'm not sure that that's on topic for AF.

(Since I mention it, here's a clip of something a couple classmates and I did with an arduino last semester: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_00rlR9QS-E )

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another fritter critter

i too have been in and out for the past few years, i still have a few macs, my newest being my powerbook 1.67g4 thats in dire need of an LCD or some sort of custom computer build. Im thinking the latter Smile ive been too lazy to look up how to take the foolish thing apart!

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Re: Every so often

BDub wrote:
(Since I mention it, here's a clip of something a couple classmates and I did with an arduino last semester: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_00rlR9QS-E )

Heh, unless your Arduino project has something to do with Camp Rock and Katy Perry, you might want to try that link again Wink

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Edited the link (in both my c

Edited the link (in both my comment and the post) to something their 'share' button gave me. I suspect there's some cookie magic happening, since the original link still works for me.

alk
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I check in from time to time.

I check in from time to time.

The switch to Drupal killed this site.

I've withdrawn from much of the Mac community (even my own http://www.ppcmla.com) over the last two years. Having a kid will do that to you.

Peace,
Drew

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Re: I check in from time to time.

alk wrote:
The switch to Drupal killed this site.

Could you (or anyone else who shares this sentiment) elaborate? Was it just the downtime and content reorganization during the Drupal switch way back when that was the problem, or is there still something inherently "broken" about the site? We'd like to fix whatever's broken.

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Drupal?

Doctor W and all,

I am unfamiliar with the term "Drupal" when it concerns this site (or anything else for that matter). Is this some event or person that took place more than five years ago? This is the first time I have ever heard it mentioned. As for there being "Problems" with the site, I have never had any. I have always enjoyed reading (and sometimes placing my two cents worth) the discussions and postings.

I certainly have seen a slight decline in postings the past couple of years, but that does not stop me from coming up at least once a week.
There is ALWAYS something to read, or share about here. Smile

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Drupal is the framework that

Drupal is the framework that powers AF:

http://www.drupal.org

Before the switch, we used plain HTML pages.

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Drupal and other Topics....

Doctor W. and all,

I found the Drupal site. It looks interesting, but what would that have to do with the AppleFriter Site being "Broken"?

I tend to disagree that just because there has been a slight decline in postings over a several year period that any site (including AppleFritter) would considered broken. I find the folks who frequent AppleFritter have a better grasp of what is happening not only in the technical areas of both the Apple II and the Mac, but also the more esoteric areas as well. There have been (and probably will be more) interesting discussions of current trends in both hacks and upgrades of Apple I,II, and Mac. I don't chime in on everything, but I am a voracious reader.

"Broken"? I think not. Smile

alk
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Here are a few thoughts. I

Here are a few thoughts.

In 2010, it is absurd that it should take 20 seconds for the forums to load. Every time you load the forum main page, it takes 20-30 seconds regardless of browser, OS, or processor. The slowdown is all server-side. What the heck takes that long?! Similarly, it can take tens of seconds for new replies to get posted to the thread.

The whole blog-slash-content-manager-as-bulletin-board doesn't make a lot of sense. NO other forum on the web uses this system for a reason. Also, it probably explains why the forum is so damn slow. The concept is nice in that it allows a single user ID to be used to blog, post pictures, or comment in the forum, but I'd say that 90% of the traffic on this site is in the forum, so designing this site around blogware doesn't seem particularly efficient. Plus, it's confusing and contrary to the user's prior experience. I can't think of any other site on the web that works the way this site does. This site is just plain hard to use.

Not being able to edit the first post in a thread is silly. Other forums also have rather strict anti-editing policies (68kMLA, I'm looking at you) as well, and it's more annoying and restrictive than good policy. I'd like to see some meaningful argument behind why we can't edit posts after a reply has been made to it. Maybe I'm missing something about forum management, but PPCMLA doesn't have a problem with retro-actively edited posts.

Threaded/nested replies are interesting but more annoying than helpful. I've come to expect forum topics to be ordered chronologically, not by subject. Nested replies cause three problems: They fracture the conversation into separate independent threads not fully relevant to the first/main post, they are visually distractive and hard to follow to find recent posts (although having the red underline for new posts helps a lot), and they inadvertently lead replies into deeper and deeper nesting levels which is visually displeasing (most users are just going to hit "reply" at the bottom of the bottom-most comment rather than hit "new comment" at the bottom of the first post/comment - we're all trained by prior experience to read all the posts in a thread before replying, and it doesn't make any sense from a UI design point of view to scroll all the way back to the top of the thread to post a new comment).

All these little annoyances might not be a problem by themselves, but add them up and this site is less and less attractive to the casual user. Of course this is all my personal opinion, and other users might (and probably do) respectfully disagree.

I recall there being some debate when the forum was switching over from YaBB to Drupal with lots of folks being really hard-set on Drupal being the best-and-only possible solution for AppleFritter. There was very much an atmosphere of "get on board or get lost". I think lots of folks left because of that, too.

There's my $0.02.

Peace,
Drew

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I still pop in from time to t

I still pop in from time to time. I went away to college, originally for network administration, however I ended up having a complete change of heart (after the intel macs came out, it wasn't really interesting, and I had no care to sit infront of a computer all day for the rest of my life), so I ended up switching to a bio/environmental science major. Also the intel macs (and huge popularity of the macbook) completely killed our on campus mac user group (RIT), it became "help the noob learn to print hour".

I now mostly frequent automotive forums.

However now my family is moving and I started digging through my surprisingly large (when did I get all these machines?!) mac collection. Unfortunately the last truly fun hackable machines were the g3/g4 towers and such, and now those are obsolete enough that they aren't worth the trouble (I remember back when I came on here often, a g3 AIO was still a decent daily use machine, and I was using my DP 533 g4 DA regularly). Now even my 2.5x2 G5 is obsolete!

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Re: I still pop in from time to t

hackintoshg4 wrote:
Unfortunately the last truly fun hackable machines were the g3/g4 towers and such, and now those are obsolete enough that they aren't worth the trouble (I remember back when I came on here often, a g3 AIO was still a decent daily use machine, and I was using my DP 533 g4 DA regularly). Now even my 2.5x2 G5 is obsolete!

Actually, I'd love to get my hands on something of a mid-range G4 (my best Macs are still a 400mhz Sawtooth and a 500mhz Pismo). Unfortunately, shipping just seems to be too killer and I don't see much locally here in Central NJ.

Getting back to the topic... I guess I qualify as old-guard. I went away from the forums for a while when I got too frustrated with Panther on a Beige G3 and a cranky Wallstreet. Along the way, I Picked up two Pismos (both 500mhz) and a B&W. This rekindled a lot of interest and I came back to the forums.

One thing I notice, though is that the problem is not limited to just AF. 68kmla is definately much less active than it used to beand ppcmla is a mere shadow of its former self.

AF used to be really big on hardware hacks and Color Classic mods. Now it seems to be the hub for Apple I replicas and not much else.

John

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The drop in older computer in

The drop in older computer interest extends outside of the Mac realm. I've been going through my folder of emulators for various platforms, and development for a lot of them vanished around 2005. There's now few emulators in active development compared to back then.

I suspect a lot of it has to do with what we use our computers for. Around the middle of the last decade was when Friendface, MMOs and streaming video became a larger part of online activity. Older machines that were still useful as email and forum browsers couldn't cope with social media.

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Re: Here are a few thoughts. I

alk wrote:
In 2010, it is absurd that it should take 20 seconds for the forums to load. Every time you load the forum main page, it takes 20-30 seconds regardless of browser, OS, or processor.

These are sever issues. The new server is sitting on my desk, in fact.

Quote:
Threaded/nested replies are interesting but more annoying than helpful.

Threaded replies will be going away when we upgrade the software.

Quote:
I recall there being some debate when the forum was switching over from YaBB to Drupal with lots of folks being really hard-set on Drupal being the best-and-only possible solution for AppleFritter.

The switch to a content management system was necessary because the site was becoming too large for me to manage on my own.

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Re: The drop in older computer in

eeun wrote:
The drop in older computer interest extends outside of the Mac realm. I've been going through my folder of emulators for various platforms, and development for a lot of them vanished around 2005. There's now few emulators in active development compared to back then.

I suspect a lot of it has to do with what we use our computers for. Around the middle of the last decade was when Friendface, MMOs and streaming video became a larger part of online activity. Older machines that were still useful as email and forum browsers couldn't cope with social media.

I think this is exactly right.

The only other factor I would add is that for the past three years the iPhone has created - and driven other companies to try to achieve - a truly pocketable computer. They're much less hardware-hackable for the average user than even the smallest laptops are. And while they're of course software hackable, the rise of app stores with tons of free or super-cheap apps has in my view taken some of the wind out of the software-hacking sails too. There's jailbreaking of course, but that's sort of a "one and done" hack - the whole point for most people is to jailbreak in order to get unauthorized apps to run. Once the initial jailbreak hack is done, the hacking is over.

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Age Brackets...

I believe that not only is it the equipment being hacked (age wise), but also different age brackets of the folks who frequent the different sites.

I may be completely off base with this idea, but looking at the use of smaller hand-held devices for social networking, instead of the desktop and laptop computers that were in use (even five years ago)for the same thing, has changed the dynamics.

Personally; I don't use hand held devices. I would rather work with the desktops and laptops I know and love. E-mail is just fine (in my opinion) for keeping in contact with the folks I keep in touch with on a regular basis.

This (of course) is probably because of my age (57). I started with, as many others did, an Apple II computer in the early eighties. I went from that to PCs, although I never did lose my interest in the simplicity of the Apple II.

Now, even though Windows 7 has hit the stage I still use XP for my main PC machine. "If it ain't broke, don't fix it" comes to mind.

I'm still collecting Apple II and Mac equipment, and books, and still having fun.

Isn't that the whole idea? Smile

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Re: Here are a few thoughts. I

Tom Owad wrote:
These are sever issues. The new server is sitting on my desk, in fact.

The black box finally ran out of steam, huh? Oh well.

I have noticed the responsiveness issues for the last year and been wondering if the problem was a tuning issue or just sheer load.

So far as content management goes it seems like the "hip" solution these days is dedicated forum software and a Wiki. Personally, I'm not sold on the whole Wiki thing. We use them for our documentation system at work, and any pretense of organization and accessibility goes out the window once you unleash the monkeys on them.

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Re: I still pop in from time to t

jruschme wrote:
AF used to be really big on hardware hacks and Color Classic mods. Now it seems to be the hub for Apple I replicas and not much else.

Lately I've developed a real desire to build my *practical* experience with low-level computer hacking, in the electrical sense. In the last two months I've acquired no less than three castoff microcontroller developer boards and a general digital electronics trainer kit. Should I ever have the time to do any significant projects I have no idea whether documenting them here would be appropriate. Given the apparent blurring of the Macintosh focus... I dunno.

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Re: I still pop in from time to t

Eudimorphodon wrote:

Lately I've developed a real desire to build my *practical* experience with low-level computer hacking, in the electrical sense. In the last two months I've acquired no less than three castoff microcontroller developer boards and a general digital electronics trainer kit. Should I ever have the time to do any significant projects I have no idea whether documenting them here would be appropriate. Given the apparent blurring of the Macintosh focus... I dunno.

Absolutely, you can document it here. Once we get the new server up, I'm going to be posting Apple I Replica Creation in its entirety, so we're going to end up with a bit more of an electronics bent, anyway.

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saving it, to not wear it out

so I've been rare, myself... lately, the regular Internet has been boring me to tears, so I've been checking the tracker here... it's alive as far as I'm concerned.

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Agreed. iPhone has had some e

Agreed. iPhone has had some effect....

Quote:
Once the initial jailbreak hack is done, the hacking is over.

And this hack is getting weak (no disrespect intended to the dev team and saurik and other mavericks) without dedicated implementation. I was hoping to see clever uses for iPhones pop up here... an iPhone ought to make a better web server than, say, an SE, for instance. But I guess even the original iPhone is still too shiny to put in the server closet. Apps are the new boss; the thing melts in the hand, not in the interesting implementation, I guess.

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I second most of alk's commen

I second most of alk's comments about Drupal above, with the addition of noting the completely useless site search feature. I don't know to what extent the change to Drupal has been a direct cause of the drop in traffic, but it certainly seemed to roughly coincide, and I personally was finding it annoying enough to put me off using the site.

On the other hand, 68kMLA went through a near-death experience over the last two or three years as well, but we seem to be going great guns now.

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The Bombardment....

I have e-mails coming to the computer to let me know when a thread has a new addition and almost immediately come up to see what is new.
The bombardment of so many other things coming in ( seems to me ) is staggering and distracts from heading here all the time.

I do not think that the amount of information being passed along here and at other Apple Sites has diminished in the least. I think that it is just the fact that folks have had to limit thier personal time in each place they like to go in order to maximize the little time they have each day to enjoy themselves.

Being an unemployed Technical Writer (at the moment) gives me the opportunity to come up to "Fritter" every day and see whats new. Sometimes there is nothing and then the next time I come up there has been a flurry of activity.

It all boils down to the times we are living in. Smile

aladds's picture
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Joined: Dec 26 2003 - 16:21
Posts: 297
Well...

I dropped off the site a few years ago when I started Uni, which was around the same time Apple switched to Intel 'proper' and the iPhone came out (as that all happened within a relatively short space of time).
I had a personal falling out with the horrible TPM thing, then I didn't like the DRM in the iPhone. (Now I don't really care about either, I have a MacBook, an iPod touch and even a DRM-infested Kindle!)

Those things, and others, made Macs less fun I think. Oddly enough I think the OSX switch had an effect too, OS 9 was awesome. Despite its co-operative multitasking and unprotected memory... slow startup and semi-frequent crashing, among other things; it was lovely to use and it felt personal.

I was on the old forums too, heck I remember them starting! The switch to Drupal was annoying to start with, but as soon as it settled down it was ok, and that was mainly down to configuration.

I, for one, welcome the idea that we could focus on electronics a little more. As I'm just under halfway through an Electronics degree, somewhere to vent frustrations and discuss projects would be brilliant, are we considering a new section for it?

(I've not been completely dead in the forum scene though, I'm on a Sinclair C5 "Owners' Club"-style forum c5alive.co.uk which is good fun!)

gobabushka's picture
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Joined: Apr 26 2004 - 16:30
Posts: 494
AF Old Guard

I havent been here in a long time. Personally I think that macs quit being fun after the switch to mac os x. The OS 9 days were fun. It just went down hill from there. As for here, I dont know what would bring the spark back to the 'fritter critters. Any ideas?

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Last seen: 5 years 7 months ago
Joined: Dec 19 2003 - 17:34
Posts: 38
Re: AF Old Guard

Hey everyone, long time no see. I have to say, I have grown up quite a bit since my last post. It's good to see that the regulars are still around.

Hope all is well

fmcat

Oelmuvun's picture
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Joined: Nov 27 2005 - 06:57
Posts: 62
Re: AF Old Guard

I am not true old guard nor was I ever a big force here in the past.. Sometimes drop by and lurk a little without signing in though. >_>
<_<

Blackstealth's picture
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Joined: Dec 20 2003 - 07:14
Posts: 119
Re: AF Old Guard

Good to see there's still some of us oldies about (and plenty of new blood too by the looks of it). Eeun hit the nail on the head, by old guard I was referring to the "good ole days" of YaBB (not necessarily better, just fonder memories).

My interest in all things Apple seems to waned over the years, probably due to machines dying on me and lack of suitable candidates for cannibalising spares - the only things still chugging along faithfully are the venerable illuminatedMac I cut my hacking "teeth" on and my PowerCD (still looking for a remote!). Mk.I 15" AluBook died the other day annoyingly...

The site seems much snappier since I put up the original question, new hardware seems to be performing admirably.

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